Final Fantasy 7 Rebirth - Which Potential ?
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I mean SE gave PR about Remake selling 3.5 million in 3 days, even if it were halved, it's difficult to believe Rebirth dropped THAT much where it couldn't manage 2 million in an entire month.
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The 3.5 million number was shipped and sold. Rebirth potentially selling less than 2 million is just sold and if the legs are worse, not hard to believe it took more than a month to get through that stock.
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How would anyone that doesn't work for SE directly have an indication of Rebirth's sales?
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Don't ask me, I didn't put that info out there. It's why I said potentially and earlier said we'd find out soon anyway once Square do talk about it.
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Okay cool, so back to me being skeptical of that information, lol.
They need to port Remake and Rebirth everywhere asap. Obviously not Switch but there's no reason why they can't hit Switch Next. Sell both as a two-pack for $70. Build hype for the third entry and release it on all platforms at the same time.
That way trilogy project might not end up being a mega-success as they may have hoped for at one point, but they should at least be able to recoup their losses.
That way trilogy project might not end up being a mega-success as they may have hoped for at one point, but they should at least be able to recoup their losses.
FFXV is the best-selling game in the franchise, clearly any concerns about needing to play 14 prior games had no impact on sales.
They have another chance on Switch 2. I hope the FF7 remake port is available at launch( let's say early 2025), Rebirth can be a year from then early 2026 and rewhatever can be launched together on all platforms on 2027 July 7.
Why would rebirth need to be two years out from release? If SE is about maximizing sales, then taking so long that other versions are bargain bin priced doesn't help much. Remake would already be that, so a double pack would be more of am incentive to buy in
I don't think SE have started working on any ports (including PC) for Rebirth yet. A double pack will be great but knowing SE, I am not even sure if remake can make it on Switch 2 launch day.
I wonder if the next FF game will become something like a more western style RPG like FromSoftware makes with Elden Ring. That seems the only way for Square Enix to expand the reach of the FF brand to more gamers than the usual JRPG buyers. Maybe they will have to completely abandon the JRPG formula of RPGs with a linear story structure, party dymanics and just make FF more into a Bethesda, Fromsoftware RPG structure. That seems to be the only kinds of RPGs today that can blow out massively in sales these days, while the classic JRPG formula games only have a potential of 3-5 million sales at most these days.
Maybe this will be Square Enix Skyward sword moment. Skyward sword made Nintendo realize the classic Zelda formula no longer had a future for mass market appeal. Maybe Rebirth triggers similar realization for Square Enix when it comes to FF future trajectory.
Maybe this will be Square Enix Skyward sword moment. Skyward sword made Nintendo realize the classic Zelda formula no longer had a future for mass market appeal. Maybe Rebirth triggers similar realization for Square Enix when it comes to FF future trajectory.
It all depends on the contract signed with Sony.
With the latest FF, there is a 2-year gap between the console and PC release.
You have to keep an eye on the release date of Final Fantasy XVI on PC if it's 1 year or 2 years like before.
Obviously the last part will also be an exclusive.
I see FFVII Remake as feasible on a possible Switch 2 hardware, but manybare saying thst Rebirth couldn't run easily on it
At.the same time, the dame people.claim a lot of asset reuse in Rebirth from Remake
So: is the open world aspect the differentiator there?
Btw Inthink SE should find a way to put meaningful FF branded content on the new Switch (assuming it is a similar/succesfull concept as the Switch) to regain brand awereness at least in Japan
At.the same time, the dame people.claim a lot of asset reuse in Rebirth from Remake
So: is the open world aspect the differentiator there?
Btw Inthink SE should find a way to put meaningful FF branded content on the new Switch (assuming it is a similar/succesfull concept as the Switch) to regain brand awereness at least in Japan
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Well unlike Zelda, FF does not have well known protagonists spanning generations. FF7 is arguably the only one that has one, but we are already seeing its performance.
I think PC Day 1 release is a must going forward. Like for example with FF16 despite being produced by Yoshi-P who is well known for MMO with a sizeable community there, SE did not even bother to take the advantage of it - I would not be surprised if some MMO PC folks would have tried the game. I think FF15 was a correct direction, shame it was in dev hell.
Would be hilarious if Square Enix does a full Sega move and start promoting their games during Xbox showcases. After all on PS showcases, they are basically selling the games to the same people anyway. While Xbox showcases feature PC games all the time so some PC community is also watching them - and thus Sega is able to promote their games to new folks. Thus we have their games - aside probably Sonic - on Xbox showcases.
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We know the exclusivity window:
For FFXVI it is 6 months.
For FF Rebirth it is 3 months.
These are getting progressively shorter.
Square Enix simply doesn't have the pipeline bandwidth(yet) set up to be able to release these games in a timely manner after the exclusivity contract date has expired.
I would imagine that some of the reorganization made by Kiyru into the focus on select AAA projects might also possibly seek to address this.
I do not know where the folks at Square Enix are going to take FF in the future.
But on that last bit, Persona 5 is right there at over 7.2M(as of April 2023).
The game is a linear hub and turn based JRPG where almost all the fighting takes place in dungeons.
It doesn't get more "classic" JRPG than that.
Xbox could be a bonus, but i think its a huge failure if they still can't release FF games on the Switch 2, that means the Japanese market for FF games will remain small if they continue to ignore Nintendo which dominates that market. And unlike Capcom they are not seeing any growth in the west, rather their games are declining in the west as well as in Japan. So i don't know if its a realistic option for them to ignore Japan like it is for Capcom.
You can't say Capcom is ignoring Japan when they made a timed exclusive Monster Hunter specifically for Switch... which does keep mindshare up in the country. I imagine that they'll eventually port spam Switch 2 with their newer Resident Evil titles too.
Wasn't FF VII Remake at 5m shipped by August 2020? By now, you guys are saying, it's at 7m LTD. This indicates quite a high number of people who were willing to buy FF VII Remake at a discount despite all the disappointment surrounding a remake being split up into multiple games and an unnecessary additional story arc that didn't exist in the original.
What has changed is that there are less people who are willing to buy full price for FF nowadays, but that goes hand in hand with mixed receptions for new FF games since the release of XIII. Unwilling to pay full price doesn't equate to lost customer for good, because it's just as likely that such a former full price customer has shifted into the camp of discount buyers. That's why I consider anything sub-4m lifetime for Rebirth as flat out crazy and anything below 5m an overreaction. Especially because the third part has to be made, so Square-Enix will do everything to set up as big of a potential playerbase as possible before the release of Part 3. A heavily discounted twin pack is guaranteed in the not so distant future, and a triple pack once Part 3 is released might retail at a surprisingly low bundle price.
What I do see as problematic are comparisons of the FF VII Remake trilogy to sequels of numbered entries (X-2, XIII-2, Lightning Returns). The latter were standalone games, so them selling less than the numbered entry they spawned from is understandable and normal. This doesn't apply to the VII Remake trilogy, so this initial sales result should make Square-Enix think long and hard about making remakes that aren't faithful to the original creation.
What has changed is that there are less people who are willing to buy full price for FF nowadays, but that goes hand in hand with mixed receptions for new FF games since the release of XIII. Unwilling to pay full price doesn't equate to lost customer for good, because it's just as likely that such a former full price customer has shifted into the camp of discount buyers. That's why I consider anything sub-4m lifetime for Rebirth as flat out crazy and anything below 5m an overreaction. Especially because the third part has to be made, so Square-Enix will do everything to set up as big of a potential playerbase as possible before the release of Part 3. A heavily discounted twin pack is guaranteed in the not so distant future, and a triple pack once Part 3 is released might retail at a surprisingly low bundle price.
What I do see as problematic are comparisons of the FF VII Remake trilogy to sequels of numbered entries (X-2, XIII-2, Lightning Returns). The latter were standalone games, so them selling less than the numbered entry they spawned from is understandable and normal. This doesn't apply to the VII Remake trilogy, so this initial sales result should make Square-Enix think long and hard about making remakes that aren't faithful to the original creation.
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Well, you can't really see the same growth as Capcom if you don't support PC platform. Like one of the reasons of Capcom's successes is of course their PC Day 1 releases.
With Switch 2 they have to support them for sure, but the main problem is whether these FF will be able to run on Switch 2. With some form of DLSS it could be ok, but it would be still PS4 level performance (allegedly) and unlike Sega - who is planning to release everything on Switch - the mainline FF games are relatively heavy games performance wise.
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7Rebirth has a 60fps mode on ps5. I see no reason beyond loading speeds from the HDD that the 60fps mode couldn't run on a ps4 today at 30fps and a few cuts here and there. If the runoured specs are true for Switch 2 including SSD speeds for loading, it's very possible at 30fps using the 60fps ps5 settings. It's not like big unreal engine 4 open worlds didn't exist on ps4 hardware already, rebirth isn't doing anything extraordinary despite being next gen only.
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Sony getting a year's worth of exclusivity when they're only paying for 3 to 6 months is some funny shit. "We know yall are too much of a mess to actually get those ports out in time, thanks for the free exclusivity"
But one thing that went in Square Enix favour is that Sony likely paid good money thinking the Remake series would be huge hits, the money they paid for Rebirth likely far exceeds the measly 2 million sales the game is currently having. So they paid for what they tought would be a big PS5 hit game, to get a Tales of series level game. They likely overpaid massively in that regard.
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You think they paid how much for 3 months of exclusivity exactly?
My point is the money you play for exclusivity is based on the sales potential of the game. They bought exclusivity for FF thinking it was still a big franchise, and now it turns out they bought exclusivity for a pretty regular mid size JRPG game. So Sony is more scammed than Square Enix by these results.
Their bet paid of, FF7 remake was huge hit contrary to popular perception here.
Its only behind FF15 in USA in $ chart and likely to become number 1 in near future as it continue to sell for good price on PS/Steam unlike now virtually dead FF15.
We've see the same argument for games that still got ported to Switch. If SE wants it on a system, it will happen
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Nintendo paid around $6 million for 9 months of MH Rise exclusivity, which resulted in around 7.5 million units sold before the PC release and probably around 10 million units on the Nintendo Switch alone. I don't know how much Sony paid Square Enix, but if they paid more than $15 million for Rebirth, it's certainly not worth it.
These people have no idea what they are talking about. The only thing that would be a barrier to porting it would be storage speed and we don't know what the Switch 2's storage medium will be. But I would guess that it wont be a real impediment because Nintendo would have been aware forever ago that they needed adequate storage.
How does anyone is aware of any sales number ?
The answer on that has never changed, but considering the result for Rebirth it's possible S-E might not be too willing to share hard numbers (although not the fact that they're dissapointing)
I’m curious to see how the entire trilogy will perform once part 3 is released. Never played FFVII but I’m waiting until the next is 1 year to 6 months away so I can play everything without forgetting the details between one game and the other. I know there are people in the same boat but no idea if they are relevant. Probably a bit but no game change.
Something has to give on FF. Ideally they get the brand under 1 Aonuma-type producer with a vision for the IP in today's market that's willing to show some courage and make tough decisions about the series. Having this whole meta narrative about 16 and Rebirth coming only half a year apart with wildly different visions of FF and being marketed at the same time probably didn't help.
If FF wants to remain as a defacto Playstation experience they need to adapt to what the modern Playstation audience is interested in. Else if they decide to expand to new audiences like Nintendo's then they'll need to adjust to that ecosystem too because FF has been absent for a really long time.
I personally think they need to take the Japanese market seriously again. Final Fantasy is not a franchise like Resident Evil. RE is like the perfect example of where a Japanese mega franchise chasing a western audience makes sense when that's by far the majority of their players and also happens to be growing in sales under the new direction.
If FF wants to remain as a defacto Playstation experience they need to adapt to what the modern Playstation audience is interested in. Else if they decide to expand to new audiences like Nintendo's then they'll need to adjust to that ecosystem too because FF has been absent for a really long time.
I personally think they need to take the Japanese market seriously again. Final Fantasy is not a franchise like Resident Evil. RE is like the perfect example of where a Japanese mega franchise chasing a western audience makes sense when that's by far the majority of their players and also happens to be growing in sales under the new direction.
And I think part of the problem is them not deciding to go full West or Japan. Like the both waters is one thing I believe is holding them back
Haven't they always been that tho?
Edited to add: most early FFs drew heavily from western medieval tropes in PC RPGs, FF6 and 7 and 12 are basically Star Wars.
Maybe, but it is clearly not working.
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They should just stop limit themselves to a single platform. That's for starters.
Right now there are only two platforms where the games sell despite being exclusive to one of them - Nintendo Switch and PC. And even then not every game reaches above 1m even on the Switch with its 140m user base. PC is better in that regard, but I think that's because there are more PCs out there. I think the devs and publishers should rethink the way they deliver games, because it is quite clear that 5+ year of development should not live or die by the amount of sold game copies. Not to mention in the era, where the games sell smaller or the same volumes as in the previous generations despite being many more expensive. And we have GaaS monsters that do numbers - like GTA5 is still top sellers despite being released like in Xbox 360 era - and new games have to compete with it. Throw to that COD, FIFA, Minecraft, Fortnite. On PS there is also Genshin Impact and so on.
In case FF, I personally not sure how Square Enix can achieve even 3-5m range at this point for a title, as there are many more games these days out of there. And FF has to compete with those games. The IP itself in decline and I don't see SE has that much potential to do Atlus moves with remakes and remasters every year as a lot of FF games are not that great. Like nobody expects FF13 remake to have the same effect as P3R. I would not be surprised if it took much less time for Atlus to remake that game in comparison to FF13. Or FF15.
In case of Square Enix, they had a series of flops - and FF14 has not had a really big expansion. At least not on the level of Endwalker.
Right now there are only two platforms where the games sell despite being exclusive to one of them - Nintendo Switch and PC. And even then not every game reaches above 1m even on the Switch with its 140m user base. PC is better in that regard, but I think that's because there are more PCs out there. I think the devs and publishers should rethink the way they deliver games, because it is quite clear that 5+ year of development should not live or die by the amount of sold game copies. Not to mention in the era, where the games sell smaller or the same volumes as in the previous generations despite being many more expensive. And we have GaaS monsters that do numbers - like GTA5 is still top sellers despite being released like in Xbox 360 era - and new games have to compete with it. Throw to that COD, FIFA, Minecraft, Fortnite. On PS there is also Genshin Impact and so on.
In case FF, I personally not sure how Square Enix can achieve even 3-5m range at this point for a title, as there are many more games these days out of there. And FF has to compete with those games. The IP itself in decline and I don't see SE has that much potential to do Atlus moves with remakes and remasters every year as a lot of FF games are not that great. Like nobody expects FF13 remake to have the same effect as P3R. I would not be surprised if it took much less time for Atlus to remake that game in comparison to FF13. Or FF15.
In case of Square Enix, they had a series of flops - and FF14 has not had a really big expansion. At least not on the level of Endwalker.
FF is in a niche genre.
Anyone who plays Horizon, Uncharted, Assassin's Creed or The Witcher will not be out of place...
If you're releasing a game exclusively on a platform where Western games dominate, don't come crying over poor sales.
The only ones who still buy FF are the old PS1 veterans.
Anyone who plays Horizon, Uncharted, Assassin's Creed or The Witcher will not be out of place...
If you're releasing a game exclusively on a platform where Western games dominate, don't come crying over poor sales.
The only ones who still buy FF are the old PS1 veterans.
Baldur's Gate 3 and The Witcher 3 are numbered sequels to games not played by the majority of the public. BD3 is a turn-based rpg, W3 is an Action rpg.
Both were a tremendous success. None were exclusive. Maybe it's time for Square to understand the real problem.
Both were a tremendous success. None were exclusive. Maybe it's time for Square to understand the real problem.
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This is not true at all, FF its not that different from Sony cinematic games and the audience for FF games its not the same since the PS1 days.
FFXV being the fastest selling in the series even without a PC version at the time, just shows that they dont have the same people getting these games that bought them in 1997
FFXVI its not the same game that something like Persona 5 and Genshin it is, so its not being the same audience, for godsake... even FFXV found sucess at the time not being "western", people are not that racists to avoid getting a game because its "too japanese"
Stop being so close minded
I mean PC gamers only buy games with steep discounts. Switch is better if you want gamers who pay the full money for games, which brings in more revenue.
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Launch numbers don't agree with that at all. Launch date CCUs can reach humongous numbers and last time I checked games sold at full price at launch.
But Switch owners are also waiting for steep discounts. Maybe you meant for Nintendo games, but other companies are conditioning Switch owners to wait for discounts. We have Ubisoft with games like Mario+Rabbids, there's an argument that can be made for Mortal Kombat. Lego games. Etc.
I would say that Nintendo games not going through steep discounts shine the light brighter on those who does like Ubisoft. A Mario game going to $10 is certainly going to stick out like a sore thumb.
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Yup check out those huge discounts for Baldur's Gate 3-oh wait hold on I'm being told it went 10% off at most.
Imagine saying this when TW3, Cyberpunk 2077, Fallout 4, Elden Ring and BG3 sold millions and millions at launch on PC.
If you release a late port with shitty optimization of course PC gamers are going to wait for steep discounts lol
You’ve been corrected by others, so I’ll just say you need to cut down on the hot takes.
In this hypothetical I assume we're talking if FF7 isn't Sony and PC only for the foreseeable future
So that being assumed, the issue is ports don't come out of no where if there isn't a dedicated team or company outsources to do it. And it doesn't seem there is. So I highly doubt switch 2 launch will get a lot of ready ports. This isn't just about FF. In general I see a lot of posts talking about potential switch 2 "launch window" 3rd party ports from big companies. I personally think it's more likely that switch 2 will get ports of notable games from Capcom, square, From, etc but it will be in year 2-4 and feel way too late.