Will PC gaming overtake console gaming in Japan?

[tentacle-tropes]

Though people play Pokemon, Animal Crossing, Fire Emblem and Mario Kart on mobile it's far from a monopoly.

To use an analogy it's like Marvel movies being available on other streaming sites, namely Netflix. They do well in their established field of traditional box office returns and also do well on a platform where they have plenty of competition but if they were to leave said platform it's not as if the platform will shrivel up and die.

Mobile is that way now. PCs are ubiquitous and access to games is only going to increase regardless of the hardware make up so the potential is there that it can reach a similar state. Mobile didn't need Nintendo's participation or cooperation to become as big as it is today. It's still early days but l think the market is large enough to support several big fish staying in their own lanes.

It's hard to see now as I'm sure it was hard to see mobile erupting when iPhone came out in 2008 and said gaming wasn't a focus of their's. The market had other plans for them though.

That’s all well and good but the data you presented does not support your supposition that:

The data shows that though they participate in the biggest gaming market in Japan they do not exclusively control the biggest I.P.s in that segment

I still wanna see this Famitsu one you were talking about. Also I’m not quite sure why you keep going on about a monopoly when I don’t even posit such. Both statements can coexist in that Nintendo has the most desirable IP in JP while independent ecosystems can form without their inclusion or cooperation. So, I’m honestly not quite sure what the contention has been; when I first mentioned that if Nintendo put their games on the system then the PC market in JP would be growing faster.

 

[MysticGon]

That’s all well and good but the data you presented does not support your supposition that:

I still wanna see this Famitsu one you were talking about. Also I’m not quite sure why you keep going on about a monopoly when I don’t even posit such. Both statements can coexist in that Nintendo has the most desirable IP in JP while independent ecosystems can form without their inclusion or cooperation. So, I’m honestly not quite sure what the contention has been; when I first mentioned that if Nintendo put their games on the system then the PC market in JP would be growing faster.

About mobile being the biggest segment in gaming in Japan? That is a Statista graph on the last page. Famitsu groups mobile with PC in their Online Game Platform in the 13th post.

Also your initial untrue statement of Nintendo controlling all desirable I.P. was made more accurate when you walked it back to most. Even then that's debatable and depends on number of people playing, how long/often they play and how much money they spend. Beyond that it's trying to quantify hype which is about as effective as Famitsu's most wanted list.

 

[tentacle-tropes]

About mobile being the biggest segment in gaming in Japan? That is a Statista graph on the last page. Famitsu groups mobile with PC in their Online Game Platform in the 13th post.

Also your initial untrue statement of Nintendo controlling all desirable I.P. was made more accurate when you walked it back to most. Even then that's debatable and depends on number of people playing, how long/often they play and how much money they spend. Beyond that it's trying to quantify hype which is about as effective as Famitsu's most wanted list.

You talk about me walking back statements but proceed to not have data that supports your argument outside the biggest no duh for ages now.

We’ll just have to agree to disagree then & move on.

 

[MysticGon]

You talk about me walking back statements but proceed to not have data that supports your argument outside the biggest no duh for ages now.

We’ll just have to agree to disagree then & move on.

I did provide data. Also the burden of proof is on your claim that Nintendo controls most of the desirable I.P. in the market. I point out one segment being larger than the others and where Nintendo games ranked in it for a year in terms of downloads, spend and player count.

For Nintendo to control the most it would need to outrank all the others combined with the sum of their output, like they do on console. The argument could be made that they have more than any other company but to control the most necessitates a market share of 51% in any one of those metrics for that segment.

 

[AshenOne]

Not happening when the biggest sellers are all console exclusives.

You do know thats incorrect right?

Call of Duty, WoW, LoL, PuBG, GoW, TLOU(to be on PC), GTA, etc are ALL on PC or will be?

 

[fiendcode]

You do know thats incorrect right?

Call of Duty, WoW, LoL, PuBG, GoW, TLOU(to be on PC), GTA, etc are ALL on PC or will be?

Biggest in Japan? Though a few are (DQ, MH, Minecraft).

 

[AshenOne]

Biggest in Japan? Though a few are (DQ, MH, Minecraft).

I mean even if you take 'all' biggest in japan, a lot of those are at least either on PC or on mobile. Ofcourse Nintendo games are the exception.

 

[fiendcode]

I mean even if you take 'all' biggest in japan, a lot of those are at least either on PC or on mobile. Ofcourse Nintendo games are the exception.

Not just Nintendo, more family or kids oriented 3rd party stuff like Momotaru, Taiko or Yo-Kai Watch also skips PC.

I think for real future growth, PC pubs will also need to start pursuing this more mainstream audience.

 

[Agent42]

Nintendo is not even big dogs in mobile both in japan or worldwide lol. They are still far from coming close to Mixi or other mobile devs there.

Did Nintendo chase this domination? It´s relevant to software and hardware integration? Nintendo is the bigger dog in the dedicated market, the dedicated market PC need to canabilizing.

 

[tentacle-tropes]

I did provide data. Also the burden of proof is on your claim that Nintendo controls most of the desirable I.P. in the market. I point out one segment being larger than the others and where Nintendo games ranked in it for a year in terms of downloads, spend and player count.

For Nintendo to control the most it would need to outrank all the others combined with the sum of their output, like they do on console. The argument could be made that they have more than any other company but to control the most necessitates a market share of 51% in any one of those metrics for that segment.

The burden of proof is one me? I once again point to your claim:

The data shows that though they participate in the biggest gaming market in Japan they do not exclusively control the biggest I.P.s in that segment

Your provided data does not even support this. It is a general overview of the JP market including a giant section on upcoming crypto projects from companies. What exactly are we supposed to take away that, yes, mobile continues to be its largest market. As for the bolded you certainly did not provide that data anywhere in this thread.
SensorTower
SensorTower WW
SensorTower Nintendo
SensorTower Pokémon GO
This is that data, incomplete though, that doesn’t exactly give a full picture of the notion you are refuting. It’s missing nuances that revenue alone cannot tell.

As I said earlier we’ll just agree to disagree since we are getting nowhere fast.

 

[AruanaRiva]

Did Nintendo chase this domination? It´s relevant to software and hardware integration? Nintendo is the bigger dog in the dedicated market, the dedicated market PC need to canabilizing.

When they started entering Mobile with that huge reveal with Apple. I believe Nintendo actually believe their powerful IP will allow them to dominate mobile market there.
But with how they keep hamstringing their mobile effort and how it seems deep inside Nintendo devs, they also don't really like with the monetization of mobile market. They just in the end pass on from putting the A effort for the mobile platform.

 

[MysticGon]

Update:

According to KADOKAWA ASCII Research Laboratories in 2022:

- console hardware segment growing 3.4% year-on-year to 209.8 billion yen (US$1.4 billion)
- console software segment even growing 5.9% to 389.3 billion yen (US$2.7 billion)
- game apps reaching 1.2 trillion yen (US$8.5 billion) in market size in 2022 – down 4.4% on the year
- year-on-year, PC gaming is up a whopping 43% from 131.3 billion yen (US$0.9 billion) to 189.2 billion yen (US$1.3 billion)

Japan’s Gaming Market Slightly Grew in 2022 – Against The Global Trend – Kantan Games Inc. CEO Blog – From Tokyo, Japan

www.serkantoto.com

Safe to say if correct PC gaming > PS Ecosystem in Japan in 2022

 

[fiendcode]

Is the PC gaming segment just software? Impressive either way.

 

[fully engaged]

PC gaming is bigger than people imagine... But no way is it competition for Nintendo. It is competition for Sony.
There are a decent amount of companies that exist here just making gaming PCs, and places like Joshin and Yamada Denki have deals with these small gaming PC building companies.

 

[Theswweet]

I'm very, very curious how Steam Deck is doing over there. I feel like the real breadwinner for these handheld gaming PCs is the chance for them to take off in Asian countries... wish we had some solid numbers.

 

[tentacle-tropes]

PC gaming is bigger than people imagine... But no way is it competition for Nintendo. It is competition for Sony.
There are a decent amount of companies that exist here just making gaming PCs, and places like Joshin and Yamada Denki have deals with these small gaming PC building companies.

Is it really competition at this point for Sony if they essentially let PC fill the gap due to their abandonment

 

[Oregano]

I'm very, very curious how Steam Deck is doing over there. I feel like the real breadwinner for these handheld gaming PCs is the chance for them to take off in Asian countries... wish we had some solid numbers.

I feel like the price is too prohibitive in Japan. The lowest tier model is 59,800 JPY, which is the same price as the PS5 Disc Edition and double what a normal OG Switch costs.

 

[ILikeFeet]

Is the PC gaming segment just software? Impressive either way.

if you mean if there's a hardware segment (pc components) that would have to be tracked differently since pc hardware isn't specific to any one use case. a great deal of steam installs are on "non-gaming pcs" after all.

 

[Theswweet]

Yeah I gotta assume the number is just software since how do you figure out if a PC hardware sale was strictly for gaming? Either way, worst-case PC gaming is 1/3rd the size of console gaming in Japan, which going by PlayStation's performance recently at least heavily implies that PC gaming a larger slice of the pie these days. Fascinating.

 

[salesguy]

I'm very, very curious how Steam Deck is doing over there. I feel like the real breadwinner for these handheld gaming PCs is the chance for them to take off in Asian countries... wish we had some solid numbers.

the fact valve has been stingy with deck numbers doesnt bode well.

that said given more and more windows handhelds (rog ally, now lenovo go or whatever, countless chinese windows handhelds), probably adding all the small ones together plus deck it's a growing increasingly popular segment. just not sure it's very large overall.

 

[Theswweet]

the fact valve has been stingy with deck numbers doesnt bode well.

that said given more and more windows handhelds (rog ally, now lenovo go or whatever, countless chinese windows handhelds), probably adding all the small ones together plus deck it's a growing increasingly popular segment. just not sure it's very large overall.

Has Valve ever reported numbers for anything? It's clear that the Deck is at minimum a success, and since they're a private company they aren't required to report sales...

 

[KtSlime]

It's actually pretty easy to tell if Valve sees Steam Deck as a success or not. If in 10 years we get another attempt at platform, we will have our answer.

 

[Mekanos]

I certainly hope Steam Deck becomes a longterm success because that's how I plan to play PC games going forward

 

[Nitre]

Unless Nintendo fuck up with the next console, PC won't overtake them.

I certainly hope Steam Deck becomes a longterm success because that's how I plan to play PC games going forward

And I am pretty sure Steam Deck and other handheld-like PCs won't overtake consoles either. These are still PCs, not consoles, after all. Still may overtake "gaming laptops". Or at least some part of their sales.

 

[brutaka3]

So, talking strictly about software, is PC at this point bigger than PS consoles? I remember that going from some calculations, Elden Ring sales in Japan were like 60% on consoles and 40% on PC, and that was at a time when PS software hadn't completely collapsed. And PC just keeps growing and growing.

 

[wolftendo]

It seems like the biggest benefactor of the collapse of PS in Japan is the PC market. And the increase in price of PS plus subscriptions doesn't help either.

 

[fiendcode]

if you mean if there's a hardware segment (pc components) that would have to be tracked differently since pc hardware isn't specific to any one use case. a great deal of steam installs are on "non-gaming pcs" after all.

I figured things like specific prebuilts, handhelds, controllers, headsets, etc could still fall under a gaming hardware category?

 

[ILikeFeet]

I figured things like specific prebuilts, handhelds, controllers, headsets, etc could still fall under a gaming hardware category?

handhelds, maybe. prebuilts I'm really hard pressed to do so. they're definitely sold as gaming platforms but they're also the best way to obtain a gpu for the many non-gaming purposes like content creation, computer sciences, crypto junk, etc while on a budget. PCs are just too weird and defy categorization at every turn, so I don't even try

 

[Tokuiten]

Voted the last option.

Basically, why wouldn't PC-gaming overtake non-Nintendo console gaming eventually? PC hardware is more accessible than ever, with SteamDeck and Gaming-Laptops available everywhere. With Sony (and MS) pushing for digital over physical games, there's no more fear of digital-only, either. And now that Sony has gone PC, there's no loss of games, too.

If I were a Japanese gamer, the only thing keeping me from going PC is the lack of support from certain 3rd-party publishers. Otherwise I'd probably get myself some nice laptop and enjoy the ease of generation-less gaming while also looking forward to Switch 2.

 

[Koti]

I'm very, very curious how Steam Deck is doing over there. I feel like the real breadwinner for these handheld gaming PCs is the chance for them to take off in Asian countries... wish we had some solid numbers.

I'm just going to be completely honest. No chance in Asia, at least with the current model. First of all, the reason why PC gaming is big in Asian countries are due to people playing FPS games, or games that goes well with keyboard&mouse. You're not going to play those games on the Steam Deck. The West has a lot of Valve fans and Steam enthusiasts, but there aren't many in the East. Without the bias perspective, Steam Deck is honestly not a good product.

Way too expensive, way too big, way too heavy, bad screen, lack of games compared to a normal PC, has power but poor battery life, basically becomes an indie machine which defeats the purpose of having power. There's nothing that only a Steam Deck can do. The Steam Deck is equivalent to the PS Portable Sony announced recently with price into consideration. The price of the Deck is especially the biggest problem, it's a good product if it was free or at least half the price. But nobody is paying the same price of a next-gen console for a SteamOS/Linux UMPC device.

 

[Mekanos]

The Steam Deck is equivalent to the PS Portable Sony announced recently with price into consideration.

lol hardly

Not sure where this idea comes from that it's only good for indies, I've played a variety of different games on my Deck

 

[Koti]

lol hardly

Not sure where this idea comes from that it's only good for indies, I've played a variety of different games on my Deck

Obviously I'm overexaggerating, but the cheapest model is 64gb, which wouldn't even let you play an average AAA game nowadays. Battery life sucks, I'm practically charging while playing at this point, which defeats the purpose of the portability feature. Would rather get a gaming laptop. My point is, there's nothing the Steam Deck does that makes it appealing outside of specific groups of people. Just like the PS Portable, it's basically a device to play your Steam library remotely. Obviously the Steam Deck is far better and useful than PS Portable from what we know, but to an average person they're both disinteresting accounting for the price difference. Especially in Asia where popular games aren't even on Steam, they also don't have information on how to do stuff unlike the West with many videos and support.

The Steam Deck is overhyped, and it's obviously going to fail in regions that aren't. Unfortunately the current Steam Deck model is not good enough. I'm not against it, but sometimes a reality check is needed since I see a lot of people being too optimistic about how well it can do.

 

[ILikeFeet]

we gotta remember that PC gaming is dominated by low end machines. ones that you wouldn't call "gaming pcs" at first glance. the most played games anywhere are ones that can be played on potatoes that are flexible and low cast. Steam Deck, and even more so the other handheld PCs, are high end devices in the PC sphere

 

[AruanaRiva]

I'm very, very curious how Steam Deck is doing over there. I feel like the real breadwinner for these handheld gaming PCs is the chance for them to take off in Asian countries... wish we had some solid numbers.

The biggest barrier to PC handheld is going to be switch being very accessible and the price of handheld pc being absurdly high.

I actually see Handheld pc being bigger success on the west as on the east side. Rather than putting huge money on steam deck. Building a PC or buying laptop will be far more acceptable expenses.

 

[MysticGon]

Post in thread 'Media Create Sales: Week 36, 2023 (Sep 04 - Sep 10)' https://www.installbaseforum.com/fo...s-week-36-2023-sep-04-sep-10.1941/post-195737

Famitsu has an article on Harada's comments that I posted yesterday.

日本のSteam市場は世界でもっとも急成長した主要市場。新作のセール待ちへの懸念もなし。日本PCゲーム市場の急成長をプラットフォーマー、パブリッシャーの視点で語る。東京ゲームショウ2023基調講演リポート【TGS2023】 | ゲーム・エンタメ最新情報のファミ通.com

2023年9月21日から24日にかけて開催中の“東京ゲームショウ2023（TGS2023）”。その初日のメインステージにて行なわれた、基調講演の模様をお伝えする。

www.famitsu.com

The increase in digital and PC share may point to a larger than expected audience on higher-end hardware despite the weekly charts showing anemic performances which when added together with a shift to increasingly global sales explains the unwavering support.