Will Bandai Namco's support improve significantly on Switch 2? (READ OP and VOTE)

[tentacle-tropes]

Square Enix wanted to port FFXV and KH3 to Switch, the latter even came eventually as a cloud release. They'll port everything that can run on Drake, no question.

Hopefully that also includes the collection cause that was the silliest making them apart of the cloud

---

As for the question on hand. I expect it to remain relatively the same until proven otherwise. They have tanked whatever expectations I have of them for Nintendo devices. Like I expect them to somehow bring DS2 & 3 as separate packages while botching them like DS1R.

 

[AruanaRiva]

I’m expecting 0 games internally developed and 0 ports from the previous generation (no Arise, Code Vein, Scarlet Nexus, Ace Combat or Tekken games).

I’m also expecting fewer contractual work for Nintendo. Switch 1/2 versions for outside studios will once again be dependent on the studio’s will (and probably a yes/no from Bamco with No beeing the main decision due to « low install base for Switch 2 »)

I can see some late port coming to switch from old internal dev title actually.

Bamco will release old port on switch 2 to drum up hype for brand new release on other platform. Genius!!!

 

[Rogue Agent]

I’m expecting 0 games internally developed and 0 ports from the previous generation (no Arise, Code Vein, Scarlet Nexus, Ace Combat or Tekken games).

I’m also expecting fewer contractual work for Nintendo. Switch 1/2 versions for outside studios will once again be dependent on the studio’s will (and probably a yes/no from Bamco with No beeing the main decision due to « low install base for Switch 2 »)

I'm surprised why you're expecting fewer contractual work for Nintendo. Didn't they formally announce their studio that's to do with developing Nintendo games? They must be serious about this.

 

[Remolino]

Just like Dark Souls Remastered came for the Switch and no Code Vein or Scarlet Nexus was released after God Eater 3, while everything else stayed the same, I would say it will stay the same at most, if not worse.

With ILCA, you have someone who probably has no interest in the sector either.

 

[BishopLamont]

wheres the "it will be bandai's main platform of choice" option?

 

[ILikeFeet]

wheres the "it will be bandai's main platform of choice" option?

No room for unrealistic options

 

[Tokuiten]

wheres the "it will be bandai's main platform of choice" option?

Sorry, thats an option only available on Earth #1 where there's also world peace. Unfortunately, we're on Earth #2.

 

[BishopLamont]

Sorry, thats an option only available on Earth #1 where there's also world peace. Unfortunately, we're on Earth #2.

timeliness are merging, don't u know?

No room for unrealistic options

third parties they come they go, Tuesday, Wednesday through Monday yo

 

[fiendcode]

wheres the "it will be bandai's main platform of choice" option?

When NCL goes nuclear and buys them out. Like they wanted to 20 years ago.

 

[Danny]

When NCL goes nuclear and buys them out. Like they wanted to 20 years ago.

Funny that Nintendo was immediately stopped the one time when they tried to make 1 big aqcusition meanwhile Sony and Microsoft have done dozens of such acqusitions with minimal problems.

 

[Richter Belmont]

Isn’t Tales series most popular in Japan? I mean looking at how Nintendo dominates the market in Japan it would make no sense to not release Tales games on release date on Switch 2.

 

[BishopLamont]

Isn’t Tales series most popular in Japan? I mean looking at how Nintendo dominates the market in Japan it would make no sense to not release Tales games on release date on Switch 2.

yes tales lacking switch releases is a big mystery this gen, especially arise which could easily be a 300k+ seller on switch is a huge missed opportunity

expect tales to be amongst one of the IPs on the switch 2 third party support slide tho, that's a no brainer unless Bandai really has lost their minds

 

[Aostia82]

Isn’t Tales series most popular in Japan? I mean looking at how Nintendo dominates the market in Japan it would make no sense to not release Tales games on release date on Switch 2.

Listen, I'm not saying I agree but

I think the reasoning here is the following:

Tales Of needs to break-out in the West, among the AAA big-boys like Monster Hunter or Resident Evil or Final Fantasy; in order to do so, we need to invest in the most advanced top-notch graphic setting possible within our team capabilities and our company budgets so we aim for the best possible PS/Xbox development environment

in order to do so, we don't include the Switch in our pipeline, even if the final result won't be something exactly not-achievable (scaled-down) by its tech, but we lack know-how/resources/time to hit that market in a proper way so

let's go for a multiplatform (PS-Xbox-PC) worldwide day-1 release with a very next-gen-looking (for Japanese JRPG standards) product and we'll see financial return

and they did it, honestly: the 2,5mil milestone isn't HUGE (compared to products like Persona or Xenoblade or Fire Emblem or Final Fantasy) but still better than previous Tales of games (even if "just because" it being multiplatform and worldwide released since day1)

 

[Tokuiten]

Listen, I'm not saying I agree but

I think the reasoning here is the following:

Tales Of needs to break-out in the West, among the AAA big-boys like Monster Hunter or Resident Evil or Final Fantasy; in order to do so, we need to invest in the most advanced top-notch graphic setting possible within our team capabilities and our company budgets so we aim for the best possible PS/Xbox development environment

in order to do so, we don't include the Switch in our pipeline, even if the final result won't be something exactly not-achievable (scaled-down) by its tech, but we lack know-how/resources/time to hit that market in a proper way so

let's go for a multiplatform (PS-Xbox-PC) worldwide day-1 release with a very next-gen-looking (for Japanese JRPG standards) product and we'll see financial return

and they did it, honestly: the 2,5mil milestone isn't HUGE (compared to products like Persona or Xenoblade or Fire Emblem or Final Fantasy) but still better than previous Tales of games (even if "just because" it being multiplatform and worldwide released since day1)

"breaking out in the West" has been the worst mindet of the past 10 years really. Meanwhile Nintendo and some 3rd-parties have been "breaking out" in Japan and now we have 10+ million selling Animal Crossing and a Momotarou that's, what, about 5 mio..

Looking back to my childhood, me and all my friends always wanted JAPANESE games, because they're a total different quality compared to Western games. Japanese publishers pandering to the West by westernizing their games is just misguided imo.

 

[Danny]

I think its unlikely that the next Tales game will not release on Switch 2, sure Tales games seem to get a bigger budget nowadays compared to previously but they are still not exactly Final Fantasy equivalent on the budget front, i find it hard to believe that Switch 2 will not be able to play a somewhat downgraded port from a PS5 version of the coming Tales of game. Especially with it being an anime style JRPG the sales they would get from a Switch 2 version would more than enough make them a profit from making such as port.

Just like Square Enix skips releasing new Final Fantasy games on Switch but make the effort to port over Dragon Quest games to great results i don't see the reason why Bandai would permanently stop releasing Tales of games on Nintendo systems when many Tales games have historically come out on Nintendo systems as well as other systems.

If the next Tales game releases on all platforms it has the chance to sell over 4 million copies in total, by far the most sales ever of a Tales of game.

 

[Fisico]

I think its unlikely that the next Tales game will not release on Switch 2, sure Tales games seem to get a bigger budget nowadays compared to previously but they are still not exactly Final Fantasy equivalent on the budget front, i find it hard to believe that Switch 2 will not be able to play a somewhat downgraded port from a PS5 version of the coming Tales of game. Especially with it being an anime style JRPG the sales they would get from a Switch 2 version would more than enough make them a profit from making such as port.

The problem is that the exact same reasonning applied to Tales of Arise in the first place.
The game got delayed a full year to accomodate further SKU and NSW wasn't one of them and that was despite the game running on Unreal Engine and having a highly scalable PC version which, at its lowest settings, made it look like uglier than some Wii games by far.

If that's anything to go by it's not exactly "anime style" exactly anymore, they left 2D behind with Hearts in 2008, they left cel shading with Vesperia in 2009 and the games only got more "realistic" as time went 1:1 scale environment (Graces 2009), full 3D camera (Xillia in 2011), batle without transition/"open world" (Zestiria 2015, but they went back on that but sort of tried more lightly with Arise), unified and more realistic proportions for characters/environment while ditching the original 90's character designers (Arise 2021)

They also put a looot of emphasis on the custom shader they made for Arise and in dev interviews complained on how late into development it was a struggle to keep the PS4/X1 up to date with the visuals.

And like Studio 1, the full studio 3 output is entirely ignoring Switch, Scarlet Nexus, Idolm@ster, Tales of, Blue Protocol... are all nowhere to be seen and nothing indicates any future output could land there too.
In any case next Tales isn't due before 2025, we should probably hear about another Studio 3 project before that but I wouldn't hold my breath for a NSW2 SKU, and if that one skips NSW2 the likelihood of a next Tales landing on a nintendo platform day 1 will go from ultra low to nearly impossible.

Look at the "beautiful" animals

 

[Danny]

The problem is that the exact same reasonning applied to Tales of Arise in the first place.
The game got delayed a full year to accomodate further SKU and NSW wasn't one of them and that was despite the game running on Unreal Engine and having a highly scalable PC version which, at its lowest settings, made it look like uglier than some Wii games by far.

If that's anything to go by it's not exactly "anime style" exactly anymore, they left 2D behind with Hearts in 2008, they left cel shading with Vesperia in 2009 and the games only got more "realistic" as time went 1:1 scale environment (Graces 2009), full 3D camera (Xillia in 2011), batle without transition/"open world" (Zestiria 2015, but they went back on that but sort of tried more lightly with Arise), unified and more realistic proportions for characters/environment while ditching the original 90's character designers (Arise 2021)

They also put a looot of emphasis on the custom shader they made for Arise and in dev interviews complained on how late into development it was a struggle to keep the PS4/X1 up to date with the visuals.

And like Studio 1, the full studio 3 output is entirely ignoring Switch, Scarlet Nexus, Idolm@ster, Tales of, Blue Protocol... are all nowhere to be seen and nothing indicates any future output could land there too.
In any case next Tales isn't due before 2025, we should probably hear about another Studio 3 project before that but I wouldn't hold my breath for a NSW2 SKU, and if that one skips NSW2 the likelihood of a next Tales landing on a nintendo platform day 1 will go from ultra low to nearly impossible

My thinking is that Switch is more like the PS3 while Switch 2 seems to be more like PS4 if you want to do a basic comparison regarding specs, and video game studios have much more experience to port PS5 games to PS4, they have done that a lot of times during the whole cross gen period. Its maybe more time consuming to port something to Switch that is closer to PS3 in some specs than to PS4, while porting to Switch 2 should be something they are used to doing by all of the ports they've reguarly done to last gen PS4 systems.

It all depends on how Bandai sees Tales of fanbase, we know that Square Enix which skips releasing new Final Fantasy games on Nintendo systems usually make the effort to port over Dragon Quest games to Nintendo because of the popularity of that franchise on the Japanese market. Tales game are also historically more popular in Japan than in the west, so if Bandai can make a viable Switch 2 version of the next Tales game it would be a mistake to not do it from a sales perspective.

 

[fiendcode]

I think we're well beyond the technology rationale for many games still skipping Nintendo platforms. Particularly from Namco, who routinely scaled down PS3 titles and properties all the way down to PSP.

 

[Danny]

I think we're well beyond the technology rationale for many games still skipping Nintendo platforms. Particularly from Namco, who routinely scaled down PS3 titles and properties all the way down to PSP.

My defense is that it seems to have been pretty time consuming do port down games to Switch, late ports to Switch seems to have been the norm. If porting games over to Switch 2 is less time consuming then it should happen more frequently as a result. Porting PS5 games to Switch 2 shouldn't be that more time consuming then all the down ports PS4 has gotten from PS5. If it isn't well that would mean that Nintendo will get even less ports to Switch 2 than Switch 1 got, which i see as very unlikely. I think Switch 2 will get more ports from big Japanese studios with Capcom porting RE games to Switch 2 as an example. Basically most Japanese games that aren't tied to a specific platform. If this doesn't happen it will mean that Nintendo will permanently be out from getting big Japanese third party games, which would be a bad place to be in the long run.

 

[Aostia82]

the jsut released DLC could hint at the next Tales of game still being way far away from its release, with a PS5-only tech - so it will be the same situation with Arise and Switch hardware

unless the DLSS magic can apply for some secret sauce (developing for the lowest possible settings, to be up-scaled by Nvidia tech)

just to clarify: I still think that games with high sales potential in Japan shouldn't skip Switch/Switch 2 (assuming it will be an hybrid successful nintendo console) at all (and in my eyes Tales of COULD have high sales potential in Japan)

 

[tentacle-tropes]

My defense is that it seems to have been pretty time consuming do port down games to Switch, late ports to Switch seems to have been the norm. If porting games over to Switch 2 is less time consuming then it should happen more frequently as a result. Porting PS5 games to Switch 2 shouldn't be that more time consuming then all the down ports PS4 has gotten from PS5. If it isn't well that would mean that Nintendo will get even less ports to Switch 2 than Switch 1 got, which i see as very unlikely. I think Switch 2 will get more ports from big Japanese studios with Capcom porting RE games to Switch 2 as an example. Basically most Japanese games that aren't tied to a specific platform. If this doesn't happen it will mean that Nintendo will permanently be out from getting big Japanese third party games, which would be a bad place to be in the long run.

It’s time consuming dependent on game. If we are talking something like Hogwarts then sure; however ToA does not fall into that category. The only reason it would be time consuming would be due to their unfamiliarity with Switch hardware. Though that would be a consequence of not including Switch into their pipeline in the first place.
Ultimately for Bandai it mostly has little to do with power or time; and almost everything to do with a willingness to be there in the first place when money is actively not being thrown at them.

 

[Joseki]

the jsut released DLC could hint at the next Tales of game still being way far away from its release, with a PS5-only tech - so it will be the same situation with Arise and Switch hardware

unless the DLSS magic can apply for some secret sauce (developing for the lowest possible settings, to be up-scaled by Nvidia tech)

just to clarify: I still think that games with high sales potential in Japan shouldn't skip Switch/Switch 2 (assuming it will be an hybrid successful nintendo console) at all (and in my eyes Tales of COULD have high sales potential in Japan)

Nintendo could release a PS5 rebranded and some games would still skip it anyway.

See the Like a Dragon developers.

 

[BishopLamont]

Nintendo could release a PS5 rebranded and some games would still skip it anyway.

See the Like a Dragon developers.

there's only a few stubborn studios like that left in Japan, with time even they will change their ways, the excuses will run out and people above them will want answers, especially when they see success from other third parties

 

[Tokuiten]

I feel like the only slight chance of getting some real day1-support from Harada-erm, Bandai Namco is if Nintendo uses the Switch 2-reveal event to emphasize "mature" or "big boy" games.

Basically, picture the Switch 2-reveal and Nintendo announces all these games for it:

- Elden Ring
- Cyberpunk 2077 Complete Edition
- Next Assassin's Creed
- Final Fantasy Remake Episode 1 and 2
- Dragon's Dogma 2
- Resident Evil 9
- and finally: GTA6

THEN maybe Bandai Namco would give up on their silly attitude towards Nintendo, because then all the "big boy"-games already would be on their system ... except for Bandai Namco's.

I don't think all the listed games will easily appear on Switch 2, but that's what it'd take imo.

 

[BishopLamont]

for sure Nintendo will market and target towards the "mature" audiences, that's the whole premise of DLSS, they have hit the limit on the nintendo/general audience, hitting the HD twins/PC market is the next stage in the game, sure they don't need to dominate the way ps2 did, but even if they get 33% marketshare of all the biggest third party games, they will be happy and third parties will also be happy, as long as there is switch 2 sku, that is enough to push many gamers towards their platform

western third parties are easier to court imo than Japanese third parties, as they really only need a system with good enough specs, ease of development/porting and sells well enough, they have been this way for a long time, japanese devs are relatively late to the game in this regard, nintendo just needs to get the ball rolling and I think they have done a decent job of that this generation, given the relative lack of specs on switch, switch 2 will be far easier to negotiate with after the success that switch has enjoyed

in saying that tho, that is only a part of their strategy, they will always focus on their first party IPs as the primary focus as always, in the end they know they can only rely on themselves when push comes to shove, they will always be the system movers, the differentiator when two systems have similar prospects and games

a system that houses the best of nintendo and the biggest, if not most of third party games available will entice any gamer, nintendo knows this well and they will surely try to achieve this with switch 2

 

[ILikeFeet]

My thinking is that Switch is more like the PS3 while Switch 2 seems to be more like PS4 if you want to do a basic comparison regarding specs, and video game studios have much more experience to port PS5 games to PS4, they have done that a lot of times during the whole cross gen period. Its maybe more time consuming to port something to Switch that is closer to PS3 in some specs than to PS4, while porting to Switch 2 should be something they are used to doing by all of the ports they've reguarly done to last gen PS4 systems.

yea, this isn't the case in the slightest. PS3 comparison is extremely faulty. it's not about raw horsepower, it's about feature set. porting to Switch is a matter of desire and scoping. if Bandai Namco wanted a switch port of Tales, it would have easily happened if they scoped for it. this game isn't Hogwarts despite using the same engine

shit, this game runs on garbage better than most UE4 games, which tells you just how punishing Tales of Arise isn't

 

[BishopLamont]

I have no doubt tales of arise will get a late port in 2024, only question is will it be for switch or switch 2 and if it will be outsourced or not

 

[Danny]

yea, this isn't the case in the slightest. PS3 comparison is extremely faulty. it's not about raw horsepower, it's about feature set. porting to Switch is a matter of desire and scoping. if Bandai Namco wanted a switch port of Tales, it would have easily happened if they scoped for it. this game isn't Hogwarts despite using the same engine

shit, this game runs on garbage better than most UE4 games, which tells you just how punishing Tales of Arise isn't

Yeah of course internal politics could spoil it, it would just feel weird if a series like Tales that have been on multiple Nintendo platforms in the past now would permanently not release on Nintendo systems, especially because Switch 2 could also prove to be very popular in Japan and Tales of series like Dragon Quest have traditionally been more popular in Japan than in the west. They probably should logically do like Square Enix does and port Tales to Switch 2 like Square Enix ported Dragon Quest to Switch but who knows if they will do it in the end.

Bandai should be one of the Japanese studios that have gotten Switch 2 devkits early from Nintendo, surely those devkits must be used for something to release on Switch 2? If not i don't think Nintendo will be that happy with Bandai not using their devkits for something Switch 2 related.

 

[Fisico]

Yeah of course internal politics could spoil it, it would just feel weird if a series like Tales that have been on multiple Nintendo platforms in the past now would permanently not release on Nintendo systems, especially because Switch 2 could also prove to be very popular in Japan and Tales of series like Dragon Quest have traditionally been more popular in Japan than in the west. They probably should logically do like Square Enix does and port Tales to Switch 2 like Square Enix ported Dragon Quest to Switch but who knows if they will do it in the end.

Main Tales really haven't been a staple of Nintendo platforms at all.

It first launched in late SFC days with Tales Of Phantasia having dissappointing sales (210k in Japan) before being ported to PS1 with great success (>700k in Japan

Tales Of Destiny, Tales Of Eternia, Tales Of Destiny 2 were then all PS exclusives

Tales Of Symphonia repeated the history of Phantasia with dissappointing numbers on GC in Japan (320k) before a satisfying port on PS2 (400k)

Tales Of Rebirth Tales Of the Abyss Tales Of Destiny Remake were then all PS exclusives, Vesperia a temporary 360 exclusive that landed on PS3

DS got a minor main outsourced Tales title with Innocence, then a full main entry with Hearts that (once again) had dissappinting sales (300k)

Final nail in the coffin was Graces on Wii (the worst selling main title to date, at >200k), that was 14y ago and the last time a Tales title got released on a Nintendo platform, Xillia, Xillia 2, Zestiria, Berseria were all PS exclusives on consoles and when came the time to embrace full multiplatform development with Arise NSW wasn't to be included.


What Nintendo platforms got first and foremost were spin off, ports and power budget entres, from the 3 Narikiri Dungeon titles on GB, GBA, the crappy Tempest game on DS, the crappy tactical Reve Unitia on 3DS and a Tales Of the Abyss port, NSW got the ultra lazy Symphonia demastered and a port of Vesperia PS3.

Except now spin off are long gone, lower budget entries as well (all of that being covered by the mobile titles mainly) so only late ports/remaster remain and even then Bamco only showed the strictest minimal effort there

Out of 17 main titles
- All of them available on PS platforms one way or another
- 10 have never been available on Nintendo platforms (Destiny, Eternia, Destiny 2, Rebirth, Destiny Remake, Xillia, Xillia 2,Zestiria,Berseria, Arise)
- 5 of them were available at launch on a Nintendo platform (Phantasia, Symphonia, Innocence, Hearts, Graces) the last one being 15y ago, 2 came as late ports (Abyss, Vesperia)



Looking at history and Bandai Namco studio structure, the next thing a Nintendo platform will get Tales related will be a multiplatform remaster of a PS3 Tales, it might be a good candidate for a 2024 release even.

 

[Tokuiten]

Main Tales really haven't been a staple of Nintendo platforms at all.

It first launched in late SFC days with Tales Of Phantasia having dissappointing sales (210k in Japan) before being ported to PS1 with great success (>700k in Japan

Tales Of Destiny, Tales Of Eternia, Tales Of Destiny 2 were then all PS exclusives

Tales Of Symphonia repeated the history of Phantasia with dissappointing numbers on GC in Japan (320k) before a satisfying port on PS2 (400k)

Tales Of Rebirth Tales Of the Abyss Tales Of Destiny Remake were then all PS exclusives, Vesperia a temporary 360 exclusive that landed on PS3

DS got a minor main outsourced Tales title with Innocence, then a full main entry with Hearts that (once again) had dissappinting sales (300k)

Final nail in the coffin was Graces on Wii (the worst selling main title to date, at >200k), that was 14y ago and the last time a Tales title got released on a Nintendo platform, Xillia, Xillia 2, Zestiria, Berseria were all PS exclusives on consoles and when came the time to embrace full multiplatform development with Arise NSW wasn't to be included.


What Nintendo platforms got first and foremost were spin off, ports and power budget entres, from the 3 Narikiri Dungeon titles on GB, GBA, the crappy Tempest game on DS, the crappy tactical Reve Unitia on 3DS and a Tales Of the Abyss port, NSW got the ultra lazy Symphonia demastered and a port of Vesperia PS3.

Except now spin off are long gone, lower budget entries as well (all of that being covered by the mobile titles mainly) so only late ports/remaster remain and even then Bamco only showed the strictest minimal effort there

Out of 17 main titles
- All of them available on PS platforms one way or another
- 10 have never been available on Nintendo platforms (Destiny, Eternia, Destiny 2, Rebirth, Destiny Remake, Xillia, Xillia 2,Zestiria,Berseria, Arise)
- 5 of them were available at launch on a Nintendo platform (Phantasia, Symphonia, Innocence, Hearts, Graces) the last one being 15y ago, 2 came as late ports (Abyss, Vesperia)



Looking at history and Bandai Namco studio structure, the next thing a Nintendo platform will get Tales related will be a multiplatform remaster of a PS3 Tales, it might be a good candidate for a 2024 release even.

Despite all that, the probably most popular Tales of-game is still strongly associated with Nintendo. Tales of Symphonia.

But what matters anyway is: Where do jrpgs sell the best? That is what Bandai Namco ought to anwser truthfully.

 

[Old sorta fan]

Bandai Namco support will get worse. They will stop making Taiko no Tatsujin games because the more recent one didn’t sell as much as the first one. There will be no Tales games. We won’t even see a super late Dark Souls/Elden Ring port as the C Suite won’t step in again. Forget about Tekken or Soul Calibur.

It’ll just be crickets. Mr. Harada will tell the C Suite that they missed the window for Switch and that the Switch 2 isn’t powerful enough (regardless of the truth) and/or Switch 2 users don’t like “mature hardcore” games and/or it’ll be a failure anyway. When it’s another success, he will tell the C-Suite that it’s too late in the system’s life cycle to bother.

I’m not optimistic about increased Bandai Namco at all. Count me in for a “it’ll get worse” vote.

----------

I think BNS Studio 3 (Tales, IM@S) might shift but Studio 1 won't unless Nintendo makes deals for stuff (Tekken, Gundam Vs). Studio 2/S (Smash, Mario Kart) and Gyaar Studio are obviously already all in.

For outside BNS, BN Amusement Lab (Taiko, Ace Ace Angler) favors Switch already, Aces Studio (Ace Combat) probably won't, B.B.Studio (Super Robot Taisen, SD Gundam) will stay full multi, BN Online (Gundam Online, Blue Protocol) is a toss up and probably moves with BNS. For production/contracted games from BNE I expect much more support in general and more often day one too, partially because this is how their partners will probably move and arguably already are (CC2, Soleil, Spike, ByKing, Omega Force, ASW, etc). Only odd thumb is Ilca and sorta From Software, though Nintendo will almost certainly make a deal for Elden Ring.

Why would Nintendo pay money for what will be an old port in Elden Ring? They consolidated their software development lines so they can always release games for their systems. They are done playing games with third parties with paying money to get an inferior late port. They’ll market, distribute, localize, etc. certain titles but they are not going to pay the whole cost of a 5+ year late port. The Switch 2 will have plenty of other good games to sell the hardware.

 

[tentacle-tropes]

Yeah of course internal politics could spoil it, it would just feel weird if a series like Tales that have been on multiple Nintendo platforms in the past now would permanently not release on Nintendo systems, especially because Switch 2 could also prove to be very popular in Japan and Tales of series like Dragon Quest have traditionally been more popular in Japan than in the west. They probably should logically do like Square Enix does and port Tales to Switch 2 like Square Enix ported Dragon Quest to Switch but who knows if they will do it in the end.

Bandai should be one of the Japanese studios that have gotten Switch 2 devkits early from Nintendo, surely those devkits must be used for something to release on Switch 2? If not i don't think Nintendo will be that happy with Bandai not using their devkits for something Switch 2 related.

The dev kits they have will be used to make exclusive games Nintendo paid for, from the new studio exclusively used to work on Nintendo 1st party titles.

I have no doubt tales of arise will get a late port in 2024, only question is will it be for switch or switch 2 and if it will be outsourced or not

If it’s coming, which I am very doubtful of, it would be outsourced & most likely for Switch since Bandai would want to go cheap on the porting.

 

[Aostia82]

people talk about Tales of, but honestly there are way more "problematic" projects within Bandai-Namco in terms of "obvious" Nintendo (aka: hybrid so also portable and very popular - almost monopolistic - dedicated hardware for the Japanese market) support

I mean

do we realize that manga-anime based not-AAA games are still skipping Switch entirely (One Piece World Seeker, followed by One Piece Odissey, or even the new Sandland) or coming as late ports (I think that few arena-fighters have been announced or released day 1 on Switch: Naruto x Boruto Connections now, maybe My Hero Academia 2, and another couple? With MANY being late ports and not always "as quick as" Demon Slayer (that is even published by a "Sony" side-company...)

And we have seen with other IP (like many "Warriors" game by Koei for example, or Disgaea fron NIS) how important it is to foster a fanbase with parity-treatment in terms of announcement, coverage, release

So let's start from the VERY obvious, from the VERY basic concept that a manga-anime game that is NOT pushing hardware on par with Arise (that IS a very strong effort graphic-wise from a Japanese company) should be ALSO on Switch/Switch 2 (if we stay within nowadays landscape with such a successful Nintendo hardware in Japan, or even a better scenario in terms of hardware feature if the DLSS and Nvidia chip will do their work)

only after "tier 1" commitment I'd go into the analysis of "tier 2"

 

[Danny]

The fact that Bandai is making a studio to only make Nintendo games could mean that instead of porting games to Switch 2 Bandai will make games to Switch 2 specifically and not port over any of their other games. Like Capcom did on Switch with making MHR specifically for Switch and then not porting over any of their other games.

A trend has been started which leads to Nintendo having a totally different gaming ecosystem than Playstation, Xbox, which leads to lesser and lesser multiplatform games coming to Nintendo and studios instead making some seperate games for Nintendo.

 

[Aostia82]

The fact that Bandai is making a studio to only make Nintendo games could mean that instead of porting games to Switch 2 Bandai will make games to Switch 2 specifically and not port over any of their other games. Like Capcom did on Switch with making MHR specifically for Switch and then not porting over any of their other games.

A trend has been started which leads to Nintendo having a totally different gaming ecosystem than Playstation, Xbox, which leads to lesser and lesser multiplatform games coming to Nintendo and studios instead making some seperate games for Nintendo.

Many of us think that this "Studio S"/2" is just an official rebranding for the team already dedicated to the Nintendo work-for-hire projects?

 

[Joseki]

people talk about Tales of, but honestly there are way more "problematic" projects within Bandai-Namco in terms of "obvious" Nintendo (aka: hybrid so also portable and very popular - almost monopolistic - dedicated hardware for the Japanese market) support

I mean

do we realize that manga-anime based not-AAA games are still skipping Switch entirely (One Piece World Seeker, followed by One Piece Odissey, or even the new Sandland) or coming as late ports (I think that few arena-fighters have been announced or released day 1 on Switch: Naruto x Boruto Connections now, maybe My Hero Academia 2, and another couple? With MANY being late ports and not always "as quick as" Demon Slayer (that is even published by a "Sony" side-company...)

And we have seen with other IP (like many "Warriors" game by Koei for example, or Disgaea fron NIS) how important it is to foster a fanbase with parity-treatment in terms of announcement, coverage, release

So let's start from the VERY obvious, from the VERY basic concept that a manga-anime game that is NOT pushing hardware on par with Arise (that IS a very strong effort graphic-wise from a Japanese company) should be ALSO on Switch/Switch 2 (if we stay within nowadays landscape with such a successful Nintendo hardware in Japan, or even a better scenario in terms of hardware feature if the DLSS and Nvidia chip will do their work)

only after "tier 1" commitment I'd go into the analysis of "tier 2"

The anime games discourse is pretty simple.

They are developed by CC2? They release on Switch
They are developed by ILCA? They skip Switch
And so on for all external developers.

That said, not all anime games are published by Bandai Namco anyway so it's a not totally BN related.

 

[Aostia82]

The anime games discourse is pretty simple.

They are developed by CC2? They release on Switch
They are developed by ILCA? They skip Switch
And so on for all external developers.

That said, not all anime games are published by Bandai Namco anyway so it's a not totally BN related.

Well yes, this has been so far: but if we talk about possible changes, I'd say that the anime-manga projects should be discussed/criticized way before Tales of.

 

[Joseki]

Well yes, this has been so far: but if we talk about possible changes, I'd say that the anime-manga projects should be discussed/criticized way before Tales of.

Yeah but it is not really up to Bandai Namco as they aren't internally developed.

 

[Aostia82]

Yeah but it is not really up to Bandai Namco as they aren't internally developed.

well, I think that exactly because those would be contractors-based projects, I'd say that IF Bandai WOULD want a Switch2 version too, they would be able to push for it

 

[Fisico]

Despite all that, the probably most popular Tales of-game is still strongly associated with Nintendo. Tales of Symphonia.

Nostalgia bias and internet bubble, for the wide market it doesn't have much relevance anymore, an association can only last so long if you do nothing to keep it alive.
In Japan it was never the case for both arguments, most popular and being associated with Nintendo, with Tales of Symphonia, either for the wide audience (all players, as the game released and sold best on PS2 then got a remaster on PS3 a decade later) or the core audience (the ones that will show up for Tales of Festival and buy all related Tales merchandising)

In western markets it's been 20y now, part of the audience who is playing Tales now wasn't even born then and the only way to experience the game they have is an incredibly poor remaster of what is now a dated game on PS4/NSW/PC

Sales wise the game sold ~1M WW on GC and held the best selling title for some time... until Zestiria, now Arise stands at 2.7M and it's not even a contest.

There's no denying ToS was sort of a "FFVII" moment for some (especially in European markets) and I have no doubt the 25-35y old audience is a vocal one in videogame communities, but there was nearly 0 attempt* to capitalize on it from Bamco either on the title by giving it some worthy legacy or on the platforms (Nintendo that is) it kept having a lingering impact.

And as mentionned Bamco moved on, from a videogame design point of view, about everything that made Tales of Symphonia what it was, Linear Motion Battle System (heavily inspired by SoulCalibur), Fixed camera, chibi design, cel shading, Fujishima character design...
The Tales of recruitment page these days lists being a Tales fan as a plus for inspiration... starting from Xillia that is

Tales of XILLIA以降家庭用 テイルズ オブ シリーズのプレイ経験

*a cheap spin off sequel on Wii 5y later and an untranslated Abyss Port on 3DS 8y later aren't what I would consider a good enough effort

But what matters anyway is: Where do jrpgs sell the best? That is what Bandai Namco ought to anwser truthfully.

Except Zestiria (first episode on Steam, usual phenomenom) the answer for them is PS platforms, for Arise nearly two thirds of its numbers came from Sony platforms.
On Vesperia DE we have hints it sold best on NSW but it's a lower seller and the margin between NSW and everything else isn't as big.

The question that mattered is an hypothetical scenario where Arise released on NSW 1) how much would it have increased sales and 2) what share of the sales it would have been.
If Japan is anything to go by (with multiple IP having done that jump) my bet would have been on
1) A bit but not a sizable one (between 5-20%)
2) A good chunk but not leading, especially for a first entry back on the platform

Thus it would give additional sales but also mostly gain its sales from splitting the existing audience.

 

[tentacle-tropes]

The fact that Bandai is making a studio to only make Nintendo games could mean that instead of porting games to Switch 2 Bandai will make games to Switch 2 specifically and not port over any of their other games. Like Capcom did on Switch with making MHR specifically for Switch and then not porting over any of their other games.

A trend has been started which leads to Nintendo having a totally different gaming ecosystem than Playstation, Xbox, which leads to lesser and lesser multiplatform games coming to Nintendo and studios instead making some seperate games for Nintendo.

The problem here is that the team in question looks to be formed from the team that has worked specifically on Nintendo 1st party games. So unless Nintendo starts forking over cash to make bespoke versions of games in franchises they don’t get from Bandai currently; I’m not seeing much in the way of similarities to Capcom here.

 

[Tokuiten]

people talk about Tales of, but honestly there are way more "problematic" projects within Bandai-Namco in terms of "obvious" Nintendo (aka: hybrid so also portable and very popular - almost monopolistic - dedicated hardware for the Japanese market) support

I mean

do we realize that manga-anime based not-AAA games are still skipping Switch entirely (One Piece World Seeker, followed by One Piece Odissey, or even the new Sandland) or coming as late ports (I think that few arena-fighters have been announced or released day 1 on Switch: Naruto x Boruto Connections now, maybe My Hero Academia 2, and another couple? With MANY being late ports and not always "as quick as" Demon Slayer (that is even published by a "Sony" side-company...)

And we have seen with other IP (like many "Warriors" game by Koei for example, or Disgaea fron NIS) how important it is to foster a fanbase with parity-treatment in terms of announcement, coverage, release

So let's start from the VERY obvious, from the VERY basic concept that a manga-anime game that is NOT pushing hardware on par with Arise (that IS a very strong effort graphic-wise from a Japanese company) should be ALSO on Switch/Switch 2 (if we stay within nowadays landscape with such a successful Nintendo hardware in Japan, or even a better scenario in terms of hardware feature if the DLSS and Nvidia chip will do their work)

only after "tier 1" commitment I'd go into the analysis of "tier 2"

This is something I never understood: You'd think the anime industry as a whole would be upset about game adaptations not releasing on the dominating system in Japan. It's insane how so many anime-games never reached their target audience due to misplaced platform choices.

 

[BishopLamont]

Nostalgia bias and internet bubble, for the wide market it doesn't have much relevance anymore, an association can only last so long if you do nothing to keep it alive.
In Japan it was never the case for both arguments, most popular and being associated with Nintendo, with Tales of Symphonia, either for the wide audience (all players, as the game released and sold best on PS2 then got a remaster on PS3 a decade later) or the core audience (the ones that will show up for Tales of Festival and buy all related Tales merchandising)

In western markets it's been 20y now, part of the audience who is playing Tales now wasn't even born then and the only way to experience the game they have is an incredibly poor remaster of what is now a dated game on PS4/NSW/PC

Sales wise the game sold ~1M WW on GC and held the best selling title for some time... until Zestiria, now Arise stands at 2.7M and it's not even a contest.

There's no denying ToS was sort of a "FFVII" moment for some (especially in European markets) and I have no doubt the 25-35y old audience is a vocal one in videogame communities, but there was nearly 0 attempt* to capitalize on it from Bamco either on the title by giving it some worthy legacy or on the platforms (Nintendo that is) it kept having a lingering impact.

And as mentionned Bamco moved on, from a videogame design point of view, about everything that made Tales of Symphonia what it was, Linear Motion Battle System (heavily inspired by SoulCalibur), Fixed camera, chibi design, cel shading, Fujishima character design...
The Tales of recruitment page these days lists being a Tales fan as a plus for inspiration... starting from Xillia that is


*a cheap spin off sequel on Wii 5y later and an untranslated Abyss Port on 3DS 8y later aren't what I would consider a good enough effort



Except Zestiria (first episode on Steam, usual phenomenom) the answer for them is PS platforms, for Arise nearly two thirds of its numbers came from Sony platforms.
On Vesperia DE we have hints it sold best on NSW but it's a lower seller and the margin between NSW and everything else isn't as big.

The question that mattered is an hypothetical scenario where Arise released on NSW 1) how much would it have increased sales and 2) what share of the sales it would have been.
If Japan is anything to go by (with multiple IP having done that jump) my bet would have been on
1) A bit but not a sizable one (between 5-20%)
2) A good chunk but not leading, especially for a first entry back on the platform

Thus it would give additional sales but also mostly gain its sales from splitting the existing audience.

most sales from switch SKUs aren't taken from other versions, it's the opposite, if this is the case then switch late ports wouldn't sell the way they do, often selling even more than other versions

this is basically the flawed "switch SKUs wouldn't change anything" argument which has been proven false time and time again, 90% of the time, whether it is a day 1 or late port, switch versions account for at least 50% of total sales which is not an insignificant amount

and I wouldn't call arise "a first entry back on the platform" nintendo userbase is familiar to tales series, many IPs that have made the jump to nintendo sell well despite always been Sony exclusive forever, arise could easily sell more than ps5+ps4 combined

 

[Tokuiten]

Yeah but it is not really up to Bandai Namco as they aren't internally developed.

Demon Slayer wasn't developed by Bandai Namco, but I'd bet good money that it not releasing on Switch day 1 was influenced by Bandai Namco's behavior. Basically "they do it like that, let's do it the same way".

 

[Fisico]

most sales from switch SKUs aren't taken from other versions, it's the opposite, if this is the case then switch late ports wouldn't sell the way they do, often selling even more than other versions

this is basically the flawed "switch SKUs wouldn't change anything" argument which has been proven false time and time again, 90% of the time, whether it is a day 1 or late port, switch versions account for at least 50% of total sales which is not an insignificant amount

and I wouldn't call arise "a first entry back on the platform" nintendo userbase is familiar to tales series, many IPs that have made the jump to nintendo sell well despite always been Sony exclusive forever, arise could easily sell more than ps5+ps4 combined

So just to make things clear, for you Tales of Arise on NSW would be able to sell more than 400k in Japan and >1.5M WW all of that in extra sales, as a late port or day 1 multiplatform release?

For your third point I don't know what to tell you when I layed out with a 30y schedule, entry by entry, what happened with the Tales series and its relation to Nintendo platforms.
I didn't even touch the point of localization which would make things even worse for western markets (Graces Wii is MIA, every single Tales spin off on Nintendo handhelds are missing and so are the two main entries on NDS) where it's mostly Symphonia then nearly nothing*

Not having Arise on Switch is a waste and lost potential but Bamco made their peace with it long ago and I'd doubt they'd be able to sustain that kind of decision if having a NSW SKU would've straight up double their sales or close to it (which, in your scenario, would mean being between 4-5M right now)


*The middling late (2006) Phantasia GBA port, the Symphonia spin off (2009), Abyss 3DS english only port (2011-2012), Vesperia port (2019) and Symphonia Demastered (2023)

 

[Kmds]

So just to make things clear, for you Tales of Arise on NSW would be able to sell more than 400k in Japan and >1.5M WW all of that in extra sales, as a late port or day 1 multiplatform release?

For your third point I don't know what to tell you when I layed out with a 30y schedule, entry by entry, what happened with the Tales series and its relation to Nintendo platforms.
I didn't even touch the point of localization which would make things even worse for western markets (Graces Wii is MIA, every single Tales spin off on Nintendo handhelds are missing and so are the two main entries on NDS) where it's mostly Symphonia then nearly nothing*

Not having Arise on Switch is a waste and lost potential but Bamco made their peace with it long ago and I'd doubt they'd be able to sustain that kind of decision if having a NSW SKU would've straight up double their sales or close to it (which, in your scenario, would mean being between 4-5M right now)


*The middling late (2006) Phantasia GBA port, the Symphonia spin off (2009), Abyss 3DS english only port (2011-2012), Vesperia port (2019) and Symphonia Demastered (2023)

Arise on NSW would've been exactly like Persona 5 Strikers sales in my opinion. I assume that out of the 2 million, P5S sold around 500k on NSW giving it approximately 25% of total sales and I think a very similar thing would've happened with Arise but instead total would've been around 800k-900k and overall around 3.2-3.5M by now instead.

So yes a NSW was a big missed opportunity but Harada don't care so it's best to just play far better JRPGs like Xenoblade and Persona on Switch.

 

[Fularu]

Isn’t Switch the leading sku for both vesperia and symphonia remasters in the west?

Also the state of the Japanese market is wildly different now from what it was when Tales of was a regular occurrence

 

[Terrell]

This is something I never understood: You'd think the anime industry as a whole would be upset about game adaptations not releasing on the dominating system in Japan. It's insane how so many anime-games never reached their target audience due to misplaced platform choices.

In my mind, there’s a reason Kadokawa is trying to build up Spike Chunsoft as a publisher outside of Japan and sinking more money into games overall. They own some of the most lucrative manga/anime IPs in the gaming space and would assuredly rather be making that money than giving so much of it away to Bandai Namco. Give it 5 or 10 years and you’ll see a change if Kadokawa seemingly gets its way.

 

[LoneRanger]

Its a very difficult question honestly.

Tekken 8 PC minimum requirements are less than Street Fighter 6 and the latter was ported to PS4.

So I think a Switch NG TK8 should be very reliable from a tech point of view. Its just a matter of politics between Harada's team and Nintendo.

Even though it would surprise they will not push to port TK8 quickly to Switch NG.But its true they should have port some previous Tekken titles to Switch 1 like Tag Tournament 1/2 to start building an audience (there is some time to happen lol) . They make a collaboration with Smash so there is a interest in the IP from Nintendo

 

[Danny]

Should Nintendo just change their business strategy? Sony pays all the time to get third party games, why don't Nintendo just start paying some publishers to release their games on Switch 2? They easily have the cash for it. And if it leads to more ambitious third party games on Switch 2 why not? I'm not saying Nintendo should pay for every single AAA game that Japanese studios make but if they identify games like Elden Ring, Street Fighter VI as good games to have on Switch 2, just pay the publishers and get the games.