The Future of Monster Hunter

[TonyBaduy]

I could honestly see both lines being completely multiplatform in the future, as long as Nintendo gets MH6on the Switch 2, they'd probably not fight to get the next "Portable" entry exclusively on their system. Both can coexist on the same systems as did MH4 and MHGen on the 3DS.

 

[Ishaan]

But the first two are dead and World, ultimately, had a limited and standard-ish Monster Hunter development arc, much in the same way Rise looks to have. I don't buy the idea that World is more service-oriented than Rise is; it just had a much more tedious grind in the form of decorations and pseudo-randomized investigations

I would point out that Monster Hunter Frontier was successfully operated for several years, and Capcom themselves seem to hold the game in high enough regard to where Frontier monsters are now starting to make their way over to the main series. Meanwhile, Dragon's Dogma Online may not have panned out, but it's partly because Capcom as a whole was going through turbulent waters at the time. The game didn't even see a global release. (This is also the period during which projects like Deep Down needed to be canned and the fighting games division said it didn't have the money to make Street Fighter 5 without funding from Sony.)

Expanding the monster roster over time is one thing, yes, it's (as you point out) a Splatoon-esque way to drive continued word of mouth so that you keep up continued sales, but Capcom's other experiments (like RE2make) also show that their digital catalogue sales remain strong even without a new content pipeline. The primary purpose of these content models, without alternative forms of monetization, is to drive sales—but Capcom's games in general manage that through strong word of mouth, and Monster Hunter in particular manages it through social aspects

I agree that Capcom's catalogue sales have always been strong, but that doesn't apply to Monster Hunter. They aren't in the habit of making older Monster Hunter games easily available on newer hardware. Every generation has its own Monster Hunter games, and once there's a hardware shift those games tend to be left behind. That alone makes MH very different from the company's other brands, and allows room for experimentation.

 

[fiendcode]

I would point out that Monster Hunter Frontier was successfully operated for several years, and Capcom themselves seem to hold the game in high enough regard to where Frontier monsters are now starting to make their way over to the main series. Meanwhile, Dragon's Dogma Online may not have panned out, but it's partly because Capcom as a whole was going through turbulent waters at the time. The game didn't even see a global release. (This is also the period during which projects like Deep Down needed to be canned and the fighting games division said it didn't have the money to make Street Fighter 5 without funding from Sony.)

Frontier monsters also made their way into mainline Gen 2 with Hypnocatrice and Lavasioth in Freedom Unite. It's been a long break though now to Espinas in Sunbreak.

Frontier, Deep Down and the fighting game team (SFIV/V, MVCI) were all the same division though actually. And now that they've been absorbed by Tsujimoto's group it probably makes some sense that Frontier monsters are matriculating back into the mainline games just as the staff has. DDO wasn't though, it was still produced by Dev1.

 

[Ishaan]

Frontier, Deep Down and the fighting game team (SFIV/V, MVCI) were all the same division though actually. And now that they've been absorbed by Tsujimoto's group it probably makes some sense that Frontier monsters are matriculating back into the mainline games just as the staff has. DDO wasn't though, it was still produced by Dev1.

Yup. Which is why I'm bullish on Monster Hunter going in an increasingly online-focused direction. They have the expertise to really begin exploring that at this point.

 

[NediarPT88]

I guess it's possible we might find out soon in which direction they'll take the franchise, if this is indeed the next MH title.







Credit to Angie from Era.

 

[Lelouch0612]

Beyond mainline games, it is true that the roles of spin-offs will be interesting too

 

[fiendcode]

Given how huge Animal Crossing or Stardew Valley are, I wonder if Capcom will ever try bringing back Dairy and giving it a global push?

 

[Ishaan]

Given how huge Animal Crossing or Stardew Valley are, I wonder if Capcom will ever try bringing back Dairy and giving it a global push?

Unlikely, in my opinion. This is probably going to be something to hold PlayStation and Xbox and PC owners over until MH6 is ready. Maybe a game that re-uses and/or remixes elements from both World and Rise in some fashion. Maybe F2P like Monster Hunter Frontier was during its final days?

 

[fiendcode]

Unlikely, in my opinion. This is probably going to be something to hold PlayStation and Xbox and PC owners over until MH6 is ready. Maybe a game that re-uses and/or remixes elements from both World and Rise in some fashion. Maybe F2P like Monster Hunter Frontier was during its final days?

Oh, I didn't mean Paradise, I just meant in general.

Honestly I think Paradise is probably just MH6.

 

[Leica]

Oh, I didn't mean Paradise, I just meant in general.

Honestly I think Paradise is probably just MH6.

I really doubt Capcom would give away the sequel of their best selling game ever to Discord Nitro subs. Unless the wording there is off and it's a beta key or something.

 

[unkindlynice]

A return to mmo might be likely? Would offer an opportunity to merge their audiences across Switch, Xbox, Playstation and ofc the growing importance of PC. Would explain why it’s a giveaway.

 

[Ishaan]

The version 11 update for Monster Hunter Rise: Sunbreak has finally introduced the post-game grind that people have been asking for. I felt it was appropriate to update this thread with some quick details because this is very clearly service game-y type stuff, and it suggests the team isn't averse to introducing more of these elements in portable MH games in the future.

Basically, the new system works something like this:

• In addition to your Hunter Rank, you now have an Anomaly Research level
• As your Anomaly Research level goes up, you can access to Anomaly Investigation quests, featuring different monsters
• These are procedurally generated quests that are completely new to Sunbreak
• They give you entirely Afflicted Monster Parts that can be used to further upgrade your weapons and armour in a number of ways
• Every monster has its own Anomaly Investigation quest, and these quests usually start out at a lower level (as low as level 1)
• As you fight more of the monster in question, its Anomaly Investigation level will go up
• Higher level Investigations give you more rewards, so the goal is to get every monster's Investigation to a high level for easier grinding
• The procedural part of all this is in the form of the quest's surrounding requirements (time taken, no. of faints, no. of players etc.)

• The upgrade system is extremely deep, and also reliant on RNG in the way a lot of other service-y RPGs are
• Basically, you get Afflicted Monster Parts from Anomaly Investigations
• These Afflicted Monster Parts can then used to re-roll stats on your equipment
• Re-rolling equipment can get you both positive and negative stat/skill upgrades, so it's effectively a little bit of a gamble

• In addition, the game also has a new currency—Investigation Coins
• Investigation Coins can be acquired by doing Anomaly Investigations, and also fulfilling certain requirements the game throws at you
• These requirements are usually in the form of hunting a certain monster a certain number of times at a certain level (and so on)
• Investigation Coins can then be used to purchase some of the rarest monster parts in the game

If that all sounds complex, it's because it is! This game is now 100% designed to keep people endlessly grinding for better stuff, and I don't mean that in a bad way. It's what the community has been asking for, for close to a year now. Starting in a week or so, we're also going to start seeing weekly Event Quests that give you new stickers, poses, layered armour, and so on. That's going to be another way to encourage people to keep playing.

Ultimately, I believe all of this suggests very strongly that we're definitely going to start seeing even more service-y stuff make its way into the portable games in the future, and that the line between console MH and portable MH is getting blurrier and blurrier. I don't think the two audiences are all that different at all, at this point—the sole differentiating factor is the matter of portability/convenience. (And what hardware specs allow for)

 

[Undead Warrior]

With the exception of random rerolling armor skills, everything else was just copying 4U's Guild Quest system and mixing a bit of World's Investigations, so I don't know if this is as big a departure from the norm as you seem to imply. I disagree that endgame grind is necessarily a "live service" kind of feature primarily because, in contrast to MHW, Sunbreak is avoiding any rampant power creep (so far). It also helps that the content is just absolutely excellent and, as you say, exactly what the audience was asking for.

I'm really looking forward to Capcom's next financial report for an update on sales because I think positive word of mouth is going to carry this game to even greater heights.

 

[Ishaan]

With the exception of random rerolling armor skills, everything else was just copying 4U's Guild Quest system and mixing a bit of World's Investigations, so I don't know if this is as big a departure from the norm as you seem to imply. I disagree that endgame grind is necessarily a "live service" kind of feature primarily because, in contrast to MHW, Sunbreak is avoiding any rampant power creep (so far). It also helps that the content is just absolutely excellent and, as you say, exactly what the audience was asking for.

I'm really looking forward to Capcom's next financial report for an update on sales because I think positive word of mouth is going to carry this game to even greater heights.

It's definitely a mix between Guild Quests and Investigations, yeah. The thing is that you have to actively engage with the multiplayer to be able to make effective use of this system. Otherwise, you're never going to get anywhere.

I absolutely think there's service-y stuff going on here. In my opinion, there's no other read on this. There's multiple material types, mutiple currencies, randomized re-rolls of equipment tied to grinding, and it's all packaged around the idea of playing lots of online multi. It's service games 101.

 

[unkindlynice]

With the exception of random rerolling armor skills, everything else was just copying 4U's Guild Quest system and mixing a bit of World's Investigations, so I don't know if this is as big a departure from the norm as you seem to imply. I disagree that endgame grind is necessarily a "live service" kind of feature primarily because, in contrast to MHW, Sunbreak is avoiding any rampant power creep (so far). It also helps that the content is just absolutely excellent and, as you say, exactly what the audience was asking for.

I'm really looking forward to Capcom's next financial report for an update on sales because I think positive word of mouth is going to carry this game to even greater heights.

It’s Steam numbers are again extremely healthy. I think an issue for MH is that the base game builds up to a challenge but it’s the expansions that really test your metal. This is especially true coming off the 3DS expansion of popularity in the West where it was a single package.

If I were Capcom I would be thinking about an additional expansion on top of each base game between new releases. This helps them keep out the bargain bin as each expansion can be rolled into the new retail SKU with the base game - increasing the value on offer but retaining the higher price.

The big question is if the next entry is multi platform (I.e. support Switch 2 and PS5/XS) or if they want to keep these separate releases on the go.

 

[Undead Warrior]

It's definitely a mix between Guild Quests and Investigations, yeah. The thing is that you have to actively engage with the multiplayer to be able to make effective use of this system. Otherwise, you're never going to get anywhere.

What? No you don't. It's even more solo friendly than Guild Quests were, since you can roll high level quests randomly instead of being forced to level them up from scratch. They definitely encoueage multiplayer activity, but that's par for the course.

I wouldn't call neither Guild Quests nor World's Investigations "live service-y stuff", and so I don't call Rise's implementation of those systems either. The live service part is that they're rolling out this content over time instead of it all being on the cart like back in the 4U days, not the style of content being delivered. And even then, this newer content doesn't invalidate old content with power creep, so it's avoiding the main pitfall of live service games entirely.

 

[Ishaan]

What? No you don't. It's even more solo friendly than Guild Quests were, since you can roll high level quests randomly instead of being forced to level them up from scratch. They definitely encoueage multiplayer activity, but that's par for the course.

I wouldn't call neither Guild Quests nor World's Investigations "live service-y stuff", and so I don't call Rise's implementation of those systems either. The live service part is that they're rolling out this content over time instead of it all being on the cart like back in the 4U days, not the style of content being delivered. And even then, this newer content doesn't invalidate old content with power creep, so it's avoiding the main pitfall of live service games entirely.

I don't know if I agree with a lot of those points. Specifically:

• Trying to acquire/rank up quests through solo play and then grind them for materials, while possible, is extremely tedious
• Past content has already been invalidated, but that's not a Sunbreak-specific problem (it's just how MH is)
• The main difference between this and a more traditional "live service" game is the lack of a live-ops team pulling levers at the backend

I think we're looking at this in two different ways. My point has always been that this stuff is flirting with models that have obviously been derived from live-service and mobile games, not that it is already 100% a live-service model. It doesn't need to be one extreme or the other—there's a middle ground there, that both Iceborne and now Sunbreak have found that suits them well.

That said, the fact that this is happening at all suggests to me that it's only a matter of time before Monster Hunter begins to prioritize those aspects more and more. At the end of the day, MH is a loot-based game and that inevitably means figuring out some sort of service model to find further growth and player engagement.

 

[Jimmy Joe]

I'm confused by the assertion that solo play is somehow more tedious than multiplayer in the anomaly investigations

The quiro crafting resources are pretty universal, and don't require you to grind specific monsters or anything like that. Your rank goes up, you get the materials you need just by playing. It's no slower in solo if you're a good player. The only case where you might have a problem is if you're grinding for Anomaly Coins and need a level 50+ Lagombi or whatever, but I'm not convinced that those are worth grinding for in any case

 

[Leica]

The only real benefit to playing multiplayer is that you get newer investigations quicker but once you have a nice collection of them that isn't that important. I agree that MH will continue to use systems like this for engagement but it isn't really that new, this is basically a mix of a World mechanic with a system from ..4U, which is old by this point.

 

[Lelouch0612]

Competition is coming



Depending on game's ambition, it could reshuffle the plans Capcom has for Monster Hunter.

 

[Man God]

World had the extremely tedious second half where you had to get elder dragon prints to move forward with the story. I don't even think the eight million gathering quests you had to do in MHGU bugged me as much as that as it least those were optional.

 

[Undead Warrior]

Depending on game's ambition, it could reshuffle the plans Capcom has for Monster Hunter.

I'll believe it when I see it. Two Toukiden games failed to really make a dent into MH. They might be taking more cues from World this time around, but none of the MH-likes have been able to really pull in the numbers.

To say nothing of the possibility of EA's involvement being a net negative...

 

[Ishaan]

Competition is coming



Depending on game's ambition, it could reshuffle the plans Capcom has for Monster Hunter.

Whoa! Didn't see that coming, and at the same time it makes perfect sense. Fun times ahead.

 

[cw_sasuke]

Bigger budget Toukiden type of game on consoles could do quite some numbers with the right marketing push. Fun times ahead indeed.

 

[Pooroomoo]

This new game is under the EA Originals umbrella (which as I understand it is basically an Indie/experimental umbrella), not directly an EA game. This does not say anything about the quality of the game, but I think it does say something about the budget to some extent (?) Sure, they are saying it is an AAA game, but there is AAA and then there is AAA...

 

[Herb Alpert]

This new game is under the EA Originals umbrella (which as I understand it is basically an Indie/experimental umbrella), not directly an EA game. This does not say anything about the quality of the game, but I think it does say something about the budget to some extent (?) Sure, they are saying it is an AAA game, but there is AAA and then there is AAA...

Saying it is AAA probably means it will be ps5/xbox /Pc and is more marketing buzzword than anything indeed

 

[Pooroomoo]

Saying it is AAA probably means it will be ps5/xbox /Pc and is more marketing buzzword than anything indeed

That was my first thought and that is a definite possibility, but EA Originals (as opposed to most regular EA games) do have this tendency to arrive on Switch sooner or later.

 

[cw_sasuke]

I can see this targeting PS/Xbox/PC/Drake, perfect way for EA to be early on the Switch successor without having to develop the game themselves. Especially if the next mainline MH skips Drake (initially) this could give them some time to establish themselves on a new platform.

 

[Undead Warrior]

At this point in time, I'm leaning to the next MH game to launch on whatever console Nintendo has out in 2024. I just can't see Capcom completely abandoning the Japanese market by making it (effectively) exclusive to Sony systems.

 

[Lelouch0612]

Isn't that game coming in Q1 2023 ?

 

[enpleinjour]

At this point in time, I'm leaning to the next MH game to launch on whatever console Nintendo has out in 2024. I just can't see Capcom completely abandoning the Japanese market by making it (effectively) exclusive to Sony systems.

MHW did very very well in Japan without Nintendo.

 

[Pooroomoo]

MHW did very very well in Japan without Nintendo.

Mostly yes, but based on the current state of PS software sales in japan, some people think that can't be replicated for the next MHW. While it is always possible they will end up being wrong, this is not a baseless assumption, and it really depends also on when MHW2 will arrive.

 

[cw_sasuke]

MHW did very very well in Japan without Nintendo.

That was 2017/2018, market has changed quite a bit in the last 5 years.
Its not like the user is saying that the game should or will skip PS system - just that it coming to Drake isnt that crazy of an idea if Capcom wants to one-up even what MHW did.

Just to be sure,MH6 is gonna do well, with or without a Drake version.

Isn't that game coming in Q1 2023 ?

Oh ? Okay Verminen than its likely just PS5/Xbox/PC initially.

 

[Aostia82]

MHW did very very well in Japan without Nintendo.

First of all, there's nothing wrong for Capcom to develop a "nextgenonly" MH World 2: it would be fool to think otherwise, looking at World's sales. But in the specific talk about JP sales, I'm pretty confident that MHW2 in Japan will see a sentible decline over World, due to PS ecosystem software sales

BUT, this time for true (as Worlds showed to the...world!) THE WEST will (mora than) save it

 

[enpleinjour]

Mostly yes, but based on the current state of PS software sales in japan, some people think that can't be replicated for the next MHW. While it is always possible they will end up being wrong, this is not a baseless assumption, and it really depends also on when MHW2 will arrive.

That was 2017/2018, market has changed quite a bit in the last 5 years.
Its not like the user is saying that the game should or will skip PS system - just that it coming to Drake isnt that crazy of an idea if Capcom wants to one-up even what MHW did.

Just to be sure,MH6 is gonna do well, with or without a Drake version.

Oh ? Okay Verminen than its likely just PS5/Xbox/PC initially.

First of all, there's nothing wrong for Capcom to develop a "nextgenonly" MH World 2: it would be fool to think otherwise, looking at World's sales. But in the specific talk about JP sales, I'm pretty confident that MHW2 in Japan will see a sentible decline over World, due to PS ecosystem software sales

BUT, this time for true (as Worlds showed to the...world!) THE WEST will (mora than) save it

I think PS5 only software still has to be tested at the top selling end, FF16, RE4R, Spiderman 2 will be that test. One has to remember PS's digital share, or even PS/PC.

Tales of Arise could be 400-500k, FF7R was 1.5M+ iirc, EDF6 did 300k in a week and Elden Ring is at 1M+.

I reckon Capcom will follow their dual strategy of high end MHW on next gen only and then portable version as Rise. Keeping them even more distinct.

 

[Fiendslayer]

MHW did very very well in Japan without Nintendo.

Interesting angle of your random post on this thread, which is to oppose a MH on Nintendo.

 

[fiendcode]

Capcom's approach will probably depend on where exactly Drake lines up hardware wise. If it's close enough (between dedicated hardware for RT/DLSS and Series S generally lowering the performance envelope) we could see a return to the Gen 4 strategy where both MH6 and MHP6 target the same (lines of) hardware. If the gap's too large they'll probably continue the Gen 5 hardware strategy of the dual lines on different consoles. And really I think this goes generally for Capcom. Honestly I think the preference would be just having everything also on Drake (RE4, DD2, etc), it really just all depends on where it lines up.

I do think Japan's a concern for MH specifically though, if it's just sacrificing a million or so like World did that's not a bad trade off but if we're looking at a multimillion decline they may start to reprioritize.

 

[Undead Warrior]

Isn't that game coming in Q1 2023 ?

I'm not convinced it makes it before 2024, but that's mostly guesswork on my part. They've mentioned in the past that they're preparing something big for the 20th anniversary, and what could be bigger than this?