I get people want to protect emulation, but some of you really need to stop sleeping with fleas. Yuzu wasn't doing any favors for 'preservation' and in fact hurt it since their greed wiped out Citra. And why are people even talking about preservation for a still active console?
"Tears of the Kingdom" was illegally downloaded 1 million times before launch. [UP: TH settles. Ceases all emulator dev and pays Nintendo $2.4M]
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i was being ironic. although nintendo has been cracking down on old roms also for the past decade or so, thats lame and its just outsoutcing piracy to other countries servers. Like, after a console is discontinued and/or the games arent available for purchase even piracy should be fair game imo. Obviously sharing or promoting roms of games as soon or before they are released is a red flag for any business and any corp will try to stop it asap in a variety of means
Nah. 2.4m is just slap in wrist lol.
30k per month for average while 100k for few months during totk release. They have easily bail out of this with probably several hundread ks just stealing other property.
It's pretty clear Nintendo wanted Yuzu dead vs suing the people into the ground since there was no feasible way they could pay multi-millions for all those pirate copies of Tears of the Kingdom. I'm sure the Yuzu creators are counting their blessings that they won't own Nintendo money for the rest of their lives.
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Do take with a grain of salt, though, the tweet was deleted because again it went viral in such a polarizing situation and it's more or less secondhand:
This will send a chilling effect to any switch emulation folks that still has patreon on especially if they suddenly get uptick increase in support after yuzu collapse.
No one will want to be caught on the eye of nintendo at least anytime soon.
Also discord being heavily monitored by ninty is also going to sow some trust issue as no one will know who can really be trusted.
No one will want to be caught on the eye of nintendo at least anytime soon.
Also discord being heavily monitored by ninty is also going to sow some trust issue as no one will know who can really be trusted.
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There was a now-deleted tweet that seemed to have gone viral where apparnetly Yuzu had support fixes for TOTK emulation that they were charging for behind Patreon. If that's true, then that's... so fucking dumb.
Do take with a grain of salt, though, the tweet was deleted because again it went viral in such a polarizing situation and it's more or less secondhand:
I'm going to be skeptical about this specific claim until I see evidence. Need better proof than a viral tweet saying so because they heard it from a friend.
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Well played. I apologize for missing the irony. Good almost copypasta.
Doubt they ever meant to stop it but I doubt this new one tries to be as blatant
It is not about stopping emulation. It is sending message to any emus that goes hardcore on monetizing and enabling piracy will get hammer fast next.
IF nuzu did the same as yuzu. It will fold as well.
It isn't about stopping it, if you think that you don't understand the situation at all.
Nintendo has removed the central unifying structure and the main devs spearheading it. Anyone can throw a name on a project and say it's "the new thing" but are they actually going to do what the organized dev team was doing? Answer is no, not without a lot of time and investment.
You do not go after open source projects with an intent to kill it, the intent is to destabilize it.
This makes me wonder though vena. Will ryujin pause their patreon for some time for now. As i dont think any emu bodies that less rich vs yuzu would not want to get dragged to this mess for a while there.
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What does destabilizing achieve in this scenario? The project already works pretty much any game any user would want it to work with. Is it not about taking down the team that has already made two Nintendo emulators before they make a third one?
It ensure for future switch release the collective effort for day one or 1 week before release will not be done easily as many of the bad actors has been forced to stop doing it and no main power is able to led the project easily anymore.
Not really since most forums had the (missguided) stance that emulation is legal based on a single 25 years old case that had little relevance to the current one.
You can bet the farm that the Sony vs Connectix case would have ended differently if DMCA was active because Sony would have been able to claim that it was circumventing anti piracy measures it had implemented in the PSOne physical media (which was only really cracked about 2 years ago?).
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The ultimate chilling effect of all this is pretty clear: who would give Patreon money to an emulator project at this point when it's gonna end up in the platform holder's pocket?
That's the destabilizing factor in my eyes. Others are going to move forward, sure, but they're gonna do so without the kind of financial support they enjoyed and with more diligence and care. Not road spikes to stop others dead, but really aggressive speed-calming measures.
That's the destabilizing factor in my eyes. Others are going to move forward, sure, but they're gonna do so without the kind of financial support they enjoyed and with more diligence and care. Not road spikes to stop others dead, but really aggressive speed-calming measures.
There are plenty of emulators beeing supported by patreons, they’re just not for active systems still beeing sold and actively developed for.
Like there’s very little chance anyone is going after Jotego’s patreon even though he partakes in the same kind of stupid « behind the paywall » stuff Yuzu did, if only because he’s only working on 35 years old arcade games for an insanely niche system (MiSter and Analogue Pocket)
This case is huge win for Nintendo.
The main consequence of this victory will be on Switch 2 emulation.
It's likely that Nintendo will be safe with Switch 2 emulation untill second half of Switch 2 cycle and it won't be as advanced.
A Big first party game being properly emulated before official release won't happened.
Switch emulation benefited greatly from the fusée gelée exploit that appeared less than a year after the Switch release as well as funding via Patreon.
The Switch 2 will not only be way more difficult to hack but emulation teams won't get money as easy as what was done with Switch 1 due to big lawsuits risk.
The main consequence of this victory will be on Switch 2 emulation.
It's likely that Nintendo will be safe with Switch 2 emulation untill second half of Switch 2 cycle and it won't be as advanced.
A Big first party game being properly emulated before official release won't happened.
Switch emulation benefited greatly from the fusée gelée exploit that appeared less than a year after the Switch release as well as funding via Patreon.
The Switch 2 will not only be way more difficult to hack but emulation teams won't get money as easy as what was done with Switch 1 due to big lawsuits risk.
? The only one I remember is RomUniverse which was making money from those ROMs. Nintendo rarely goes after anything unless it passes a line they aren't willing to let it go. Usually that includes profiting from the stuff, large amounts of downloads, current-gen stuff, etc. I mean just look at all the ROM sites still available. Ppl be saying stuff like how Nintendo would sue a kid named Mario. I know it's a joke, but these people are over-exaggerating.
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Yeah, that's the point I was getting across in how this relates to more current hardware emulation, which was where people were debating a chilling effect to take place from this.
If i am ryujin i will even stop patreon page at least for several months or half a year there to ensure no more heat on this topic for the times.
Also make sure no stupid sites will went wild west happy on plastering ryujin name on any nintendo first party release played on the emus same day as the game is released. Because believe it or not. Those kotaku article that challenge nintendo with dread article is not going to have good image in nintendo hq.
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I still remember when that Kotaku writer got mad at Nintendo for not sending early review codes after that Dread article. These people have zero ethical and moral codes.
It’s like punching a person and then getting mad that they don’t want to be your friend. In their minds, they don’t even recognize that Nintendo is made of up of real human beings. They think they’re fighting some abstract being known as “billion dollar company” and that’s why their toxic behavior is justified. Because they’re not hurting “real people.”
Another example would be like walking into a bakery and saying that it’s shit right in front of the owner and employees. Then going on some weird tirade about how you’re not insulting any real people and that you’re only attacking the bakery itself. It’s like Don Quixote fighting a windmill.
The sheer entitlement and delusion involved is astounding. There are still tons of hardcore PC gamers who lack the self-awareness to see what they did wrong and still want to spite Nintendo because they think they’re “morally right.” Ryujinx devs better not be swayed by these idiots and egged into provoking Nintendo. The more they lay low, the better their chance of surviving. If Kotaku or any big gaming sites want to write an article on using Ryujinx to pirate games, the devs should send them an email telling them to quiet the fuck down like a normal human being.
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I dont think the people paying the monthly fee for the paetron would really care? They would still get the product, at least until it gets shut down. The chilling effect is absolutely about potential developers being afraid of being sued.
Yup. The main reason why this snowballed into this is because.
Yuzu get absurdly greedy and then the journalist and so called pc master race gets extra smug. In the end it blow to their face.
Settlement seems like the best possible result for fans of emulation. DMCA/keys angle still exists for consoles the past two decades so I'm hopeful another company doesn't push the line with bringing a platform holder into action.
DMCA applies to anything that has copy protections/drm in place. One could make the case that enabling Donkey Kong Country 3 to work in emulators is bypassing Nintendo’s protection systems (used to prevent the game from beeing played on a SNES copier back in the day).
Thing ls, Nintendo, Sega and Sony won’t go after these emulators because they won’t really hurt their bottom lines, but anti tampering/protection systems were put in place way way before the DMCA was enabled and while you couldn’t prosecute someone for past offenses (since the law wasn’t a thing), anyone developing new mechanisms to bypass these security checks today would be targetable by interested parties.
Just so that people understand that protection and drm aren’t a new thing at all. There are Amiga games that are still not properly cracked (and thus, preserved) for example (BAT 2 is a prime example)
I thought DMCA would only apply to software copy protections though? Not hardware based solutions (lockout chips, casing lockouts, etc)?
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It has always been like this. People treat companies like their own entity instead of what they are, a business run by people and made from employees no different than the indie developers that people love. The only difference, these people made. They reached the top and get to work on the games that you and I dreamed of. Think of all those new blood Zelda developers who worked on Breath of the Wild and Tears of the Kingdom, or SMBW and Odyssey, or Splatoon 3.
There is this need on the internet to punish success because all the arguments to justify emulation or piracy on companies like Nintendo are never implied to indies and you will be hung by the online mob if you did suggest such ha thing.
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The screenshot doesn't prove that Yuzu devs were distributing Switch ROMs. While I wouldn't be surprised if they were, there is the possibility that Yuzu worked with new games day 1 because it happened to emulate the Switch hardware well in general.
Most copy protections were a mix of software locks and hardware locks. For instance SFC and PSOne copy protections would have the games detect the hardware it was running on and if something was interfacing with the cartridge port (sfc) or the hardware components (psone/modchips). On top of that the PSone (and Saturn) had readable (but unwritable) data on the inner ring allowing the system to know it was running a legitimate game, this specific part was hardware and was what modchips bypassed (often by feeding the system a generic known game serial).
On the Amiga (and ST) you had special tracks on discs, manual checks, color coded wheels, external dongles and so on. FTL and Readysoft (the people behind Bleem) had some notoriously difficult to crack games (because you would think they were cracked but the games punished you the further you went into the game)
I think the funniest and one of the biggest repeating justification for Nintendo piracy among online gamers is that Nintendo isn't making powerful consoles, so basically if Nintendo doesn't follow Sony's failing business model with low profit margins by making too expensive hardware then Nintendo should be pirated. The Blue Ocean strategy is the strategy that have kept Nintendo in the hardware business in the last few decades since the Gamecube. I ak 100 % sure that if Nintendo didn't opt for the blue ocean strategy with the Wii and instead tried to compete on power they would have gone the same way as Sega by now because they would always be a distant third on that metric.
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The Nintendo DS emulator Drastic is now free as Yuzu lawsuit fallout begins
Abundance of caution?
www.theverge.com
The chilling effect begins.
Like i believe, the effect is going to hit any emulation linked with ninty and they has monetization done for profit.
I honestly had no idea how many paid emulators for things there are apparently, I never paid a cent for any I've ever used so I didn't think that was really a thing considering that that seems like it would be very easy to get into trouble legally doing.
There is a lot for sure. It is business after all. It is just yuzu went far and beyond to make it even lucurative business lol.
Some of them definitely overreacted.The Nintendo DS emulator Drastic is now free as Yuzu lawsuit fallout begins
Abundance of caution?
The chilling effect begins.
Like i believe, the effect is going to hit any emulation linked with ninty and they has monetization done for profit.
Of course. But thats what ninty want as after effect. The more fear the other emus feels the better for ninty future.
I think the hardware will also prove much more difficult emulate for a longer period of time as well.
Nintendo fired a warning shot, and the timing of it right before the Switch 2 launch was very deliberate.
I predict salty PC gamers who will have to buy Switch 2's to play Nintendo's best throughout the opening years of Switch 2.
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Another emulator is shutting down.
Pizza Emulators, which made Game Boy Advance and Game Boy Color emulators on Android, has pulled all of its apps from the Google Play Store. In a message on Discord, developer Davide Berra writes that he’s shutting down the emulators “to prioritize my family over the development of my apps.” The...
www.theverge.com
The chilling effect continous. Yuzu greed truly has lead to all this mess.
Many emu makers seems to get spooked hard by nintendo vs Yuzu case there.