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[Nikkei/Rumor] Next Switch development is "progressing well", due in 2024 [UPDATE: VGC/Eurogamer share more details]

What would be the best time for a new Switch 2024 launch ?

  • April-May 2024

    Votes: 158 42.8%
  • June-September 2024

    Votes: 77 20.9%
  • October-November 2024

    Votes: 134 36.3%

  • Total voters
    369
I think they have done a decent job at that given the change we've seen in the western space. it's just that Nintendo offered more to publishers they were lacking in. it makes me wonder if there are business reasons relating to that for Bamco and Sega. SE and Capcom get some benefits that we aren't seeing with the other two, and I wonder if it has to do with historical support not being as lackluster (though one can easily say the same for SE and Capcom, but Nintendo does more for them, because they reap more rewards)
The difference is largely upper management and internal engine support.

Within 2 years of Nagoshi being taken off the board of directors and stripped of his Chief Creative Officer title, suddenly Sega is singing a slightly different tune with Switch in exceedingly noticeable ways. Meanwhile, Harada is in charge at Bandai Namco.

Additionally, while Capcom eventually had to do a specialized RE Engine work-up for MHR to support expanded vision in light of its market performance, MT Framework was quickly accommodated for Switch. Likewise, outside BDU1 and 3 at Square, Unreal Engine 4 or Unity ruled the roost, so Switch reaped benefits there by being supported in UE4/Unity. The same cannot be said for Dragon Engine and whatever tools Atlus had been using.

A combination of these factors is what leads to the circumstances of which publishers are and are not present. And when something about these factors changes (see example: Astral Chain convincing Square Enix that Nier Automata would be doable on Switch since both were made by Platinum and therefore utilize the same or similar engine), so will the support.
 
Even if the relative gap between Switch 2 and PS5 is the same as Switch and PS4, there will still be fewer issues with ported games because one of the main problems was how blurry games looked, not that they had pared back graphics. That’s why DLSS is a big help. A super scaled back PS5 game running at high res thanks to DLSS will still look way better than the Witcher 3 did on Switch, and at that point porting games makes even more sense because the system is still portable.
 
Additionally, while Capcom eventually had to do a specialized RE Engine work-up for MHR to support expanded vision in light of its market performance, MT Framework was quickly accommodated for Switch. Likewise, outside BDU1 and 3 at Square, Unreal Engine 4 or Unity ruled the roost, so Switch reaped benefits there by being supported in UE4/Unity. The same cannot be said for Dragon Engine and whatever tools Atlus had been using.
Dragon Engine sounded more like it has been in its death bed for longer than we expected. I don't think the engine had too many updates since the start of the generation and then the remake comes along on ue4 and a discussion about whether or not to swap tools. Atlus is atlus and don't seem to have much to engineering.

Regardless, it's not so much of a hardware problem but a lack of desire to put in the work for support. I find it harder to believe in supporting Switch from a tools perspective being problematic than anything else.
 
Dragon Engine sounded more like it has been in its death bed for longer than we expected. I don't think the engine had too many updates since the start of the generation and then the remake comes along on ue4 and a discussion about whether or not to swap tools. Atlus is atlus and don't seem to have much to engineering.

Regardless, it's not so much of a hardware problem but a lack of desire to put in the work for support. I find it harder to believe in supporting Switch from a tools perspective being problematic than anything else.
And yet, when you actually view support from a tools perspective, a lot of things make better sense, with very few exceptions in either direction. And it's not about the conversion of tools being "problematic", there has to be the will and money to put the time in first, and a willingness to trim certain features off the engine to get it working on Switch second; both hurdles need clearing. These necessities were deficient to non-existent at certain publishers/developers but not an issue in the slightest at others.
 
And yet, when you actually view support from a tools perspective, a lot of things make better sense, with very few exceptions in either direction. And it's not about the conversion of tools being "problematic", there has to be the will and money to put the time in first, and a willingness to trim certain features off the engine to get it working on Switch second; both hurdles need clearing. These necessities were deficient to non-existent at certain publishers/developers but not an issue in the slightest at others.
I don't see how this goes against what I'm saying. tools are only the problem because the leads in question don't want to support the system. what does Nintendo have to do to change their minds? roll out the red carpet like they've done for SE, Capcom, WB, CDPR, etc? because I don't think they stand to gain as much with Sega and Bamco as they do with these other studios. there is room for Bamco's and Sega's success, Nintendo doesn't need to send the limos to a steak dinner for them for nothing but licensing money
 
Whether something happens or not, I feel we should be more criticial of certain publisher decisions and not be like "ah well, Bandai Namco not supporting Switch is normal, whatever". Of course, that doesn't mean we need to talk about it every week ;)
You’re right- we need to talk about it everyday.
 
Macronix (2337) this year, although facing the general environment of poor consumer sentiment, continued to reduce production, but in the progress of research and development and research and development costs, the company has not shrunk, the company's current new product development as progressed, 3D Nand flash 96-layer products have been gradually given to customers sample, the main focus of the game machine industry, and so on the other side of the verification, this year is expected to be released.

In addition to 3D Nand flash 96-layer products, 192-layer products are also progressing smoothly, with the goal of mass production next year. Macronix's current 3D Nand flash products are mainly used in the gaming industry, with specific application markets, rather than competing with the world's largest memory manufacturers.

In addition, Macronix is also developing 3D Nor flash to achieve high capacity on the one hand, and to perform with good read quality compared to traditional Nor flash on the other, and good progress has been made so far.
Credits to Hartmann at Nintendo Future Hardware on Famiboards
 

Credits to Hartmann at Nintendo Future Hardware on Famiboards
When they say “gaming machine”, I am reminded they could be referring to gambling devices and not video game consoles.
I don't see how this goes against what I'm saying. tools are only the problem because the leads in question don't want to support the system. what does Nintendo have to do to change their minds? roll out the red carpet like they've done for SE, Capcom, WB, CDPR, etc? because I don't think they stand to gain as much with Sega and Bamco as they do with these other studios. there is room for Bamco's and Sega's success, Nintendo doesn't need to send the limos to a steak dinner for them for nothing but licensing money
At this point, Nintendo has to do very little. With a technological advance on their end, it becomes a lot more economical to get support for tools up and running when those tools are still being used to make PS4 software in 2023. They don’t have to wine and dine obstructive upper management, they don’t have to do much of anything other than just make the tool solution economical enough that the people being obstructive are overruled by the individuals they report to who can easily identify the economical advantages of getting engines/tools working on the next Nintendo hardware. And that, of course, is under the assumption that such individuals are so obstinate that they would not come to the reasonable conclusion on their own, which remains to be seen.
Simply put, these two considerations have significant interplay with one another on this issue and has as much to do with money and resources as it does folks at publishers just saying they don’t wanna.
 
When they say “gaming machine”, I am reminded they could be referring to gambling devices and not video game consoles.
The original Chinese very clearly means gaming-gaming and not gambling-gaming.

EDIT: Also, the machine translation kind of mangled the last sentence of the first paragraph. What it said is "production is expected to greatly increase this year once the customer completes its verification."
 
The original Chinese very clearly means gaming-gaming and not gambling-gaming.

EDIT: Also, the machine translation kind of mangled the last sentence of the first paragraph. What it said is "production is expected to greatly increase this year once the customer completes its verification."
So it's another report stating Macronix is providing 3D NAND to Nintendo. Considering the last report of this kind back in 2019 (with a 2020 delivery) became an absolute nothingburger, I'm not holding my breath, but I'd absolutely believe that Nintendo is receiving part samples as part of bidding for the NAND flash part contract on Nintendo's next hardware along with every other supplier in the space.
 
it's not crazy that Macronix has been sampling product back in 2019. the why they never been delivered can be debated, but a product like this undergoing constant R&D should be expected
 
The why they never been delivered can be debated, but a product like this undergoing constant R&D should be expected
If I am to make a guess at that, I would suspect that it would have something to do with either power delivery or thermal management.

AMD's X3D CPU line is known to have this issue, it's part of the reason the chips are locked (it also explains recently overvolt issues with board partners) in a attempt to control that. As of late back-side power delivery has been a talking point with stacks. So maybe something like that is keeping Macronix from bring this to market?
 
I hope it's not just a more powerful Switch. Switch is a device that stores and run software, with joycons is a handheld, with the dock and a TV is a console. Switch 2 could be a stand alone VR device too if you buy the Nintendo VR headset and put the Switch in it.
 
I hope it's not just a more powerful Switch. Switch is a device that stores and run software, with joycons is a handheld, with the dock and a TV is a console. Switch 2 could be a stand alone VR device too if you buy the Nintendo VR headset and put the Switch in it.
Then Nintendo better prepare for lawsuits due to all those little children getting neck injuries from the heavy weight of the Switch 2.

Have you ever compared the weight of a Switch to PSVR? The latter is much lighter and has a better weight distribution. Switch VR would just be putting a giant weight at the front of your head. Terrible.
 
I hope it's not just a more powerful Switch. Switch is a device that stores and run software, with joycons is a handheld, with the dock and a TV is a console. Switch 2 could be a stand alone VR device too if you buy the Nintendo VR headset and put the Switch in it.
Nintendo's entire ethos of "lateral thinking with withered technology" is anathema to VR. Plus, the one time they chased the new tech trend like that (3D) it really didn't work out.
 
Then Nintendo better prepare for lawsuits due to all those little children getting neck injuries from the heavy weight of the Switch 2.

Have you ever compared the weight of a Switch to PSVR? The latter is much lighter and has a better weight distribution. Switch VR would just be putting a giant weight at the front of your head. Terrible.
NSW is 300g, Quest 2 with decent strap is around 600g. Nintendo would need to focus not just on power and backward compatibility, but on size and weight also. I admit it could lead to compromises (smaller cartridges, no backward compatibility). Nintendo could even change the way Switch is modular: currently the "core" of the Switch has a screen and the cartridge reader.
 
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Nintendo was burned so badly by the Virtual Boy in the 90's that they'll be the absolute last team to the party if VR ever becomes massive and mainstream.
 
Valve has one ecosystem for desktop, handheld, and wired VR gaming. No standalone VR.

Nintendo could have console, handheld and standalone VR in one ecosystem and one device (but they would still need to sell the VR headset separately as it would cost 600-700$ to get everything).

I don't know if the VR market is worth it, currently, for Nintendo.
 
Valve has one ecosystem for desktop, handheld, and wired VR gaming. No standalone VR.

Nintendo could have console, handheld and standalone VR in one ecosystem and one device (but they would still need to sell the VR headset separately as it would cost 600-700$ to get everything).

I don't know if the VR market is worth it, currently, for Nintendo.
If the VR market isn’t worth it currently then why would Nintendo pursue it. There are plenty of issues outside Virtual Boys failure that puts Nintendo off VR, your pricing is one of them.
 
Nintendo isn't going to touch VR. It's going to be a more powerful Switch with some kind of new gimmick. Maybe they'll double down on the touch screen or some new joy con functionality.

If Nintendo ever did get crazy with new tech, IMO they would go after either holograms or some lite-AR. VR is not in their future.
 
Nintendo's entire ethos of "lateral thinking with withered technology" is anathema to VR. Plus, the one time they chased the new tech trend like that (3D) it really didn't work out.
the whole "withered technology" thing has since passed because hardware development is significantly different than the days of Yokoi. if you want to call an A78/Ampere/LPDDR5-based tablet withered, you might want to see how A710/Lovelace/LPDDR5X fairs in the same power envelope
 
the whole "withered technology" thing has since passed because hardware development is significantly different than the days of Yokoi. if you want to call an A78/Ampere/LPDDR5-based tablet withered, you might want to see how A710/Lovelace/LPDDR5X fairs in the same power envelope
It’s not even understood for what that phrase actually means. Yokoi used “withered technology” to describe technology that had matured to a point of familiarity and cost reduction.
 
You're right to be doubtful. I just think Nintendo would make great software for it and that VR is a good fit for many games available on Nintendo platforms (golf and other sports, fitness, rhythm games, Metroid).

We're also getting closer and closer for something like this to be feasible at a reasonable price. The 600-700$ numbers I wrote include a 400$ NSW2, Quest 2 "cost" 300$, Meta loses money on it but Quest does run the games and the controllers are bundled with it.

I'm not 100% convinced it's going to happen (more like 20%), I think it would be great and that it would make sense.
 
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It’s not even understood for what that phrase actually means. Yokoi used “withered technology” to describe technology that had matured to a point of familiarity and cost reduction.
even with that definition, Nintendo hasn't done that much anymore. as soon as nodes reach end of life, they start to become more expensive and node redesigns become costly. it's why I expect the successor to be on TSMC's 5nm like the current crop of Nvidia gpus because it'd actually be cheaper
 
You're right to be doubtful. I just think Nintendo would make great software for it and that VR is a good fit for many games available on Nintendo platforms (golf and other sports, fitness, rhythm games, Metroid).

We're also getting closer and closer for something like this to be feasible at a reasonable price. The 600-700$ numbers I wrote includes a 400$ NSW2, Quest 2 "cost" 300$, Meta loses money on it but Quest does run the games and the controllers are bundled with it.

I'm not 100% convinced it's going to happen (more like 20%), I think it would be great and that it would make sense.
VR stands in stark contrast to the Switch's philosophy. It tends to isolate users, lacking capabilities for multiple people to engage together using a single unit. Additionally, it carries a hefty price tag, and it's not recommended for children under the age of 13. In essence, it diverges from the Switch's more accessible and sociable ethos.
 
Hey, haven't you ever arranged a VR rooftop party!?
56cb0b3bdd0895ab638b4597


see, look at all those people playing together
 
even with that definition, Nintendo hasn't done that much anymore. as soon as nodes reach end of life, they start to become more expensive and node redesigns become costly. it's why I expect the successor to be on TSMC's 5nm like the current crop of Nvidia gpus because it'd actually be cheaper
Nah, they still do it plenty, just not to the absolute insane degree that could be achieved in the 80s and early 90s. Yes, even with Switch.

They could have implemented an ARM7-A based chip in 3DS (with a slight delay they could easily afford) at a low clock for a smaller chip, but they didn’t, because while they knew ARM tech (and still ended up with an ARM CPU because it was a RISC ISA like their consoles and past handhelds were, which offers some comfort and easier understanding), they did not know ARM7-A and, at the time, neither did anyone else, because it was brand new. Likewise, by the time Switch rolled around, 64-bit ARM8-A was not only available, it was a known quantity across the whole industry thanks to smartphone makers. It was “mature”, if not in cost, than in familiarity.

I’ve also argued that there’s really nothing cutting-edge about the Tegra series Nvidia has cooked up and, in a twist, actually lives up to the other half of that Yokoi phrase, in that it now uses a lot of “lateral thinking” (aka novel techniques or uses) with mature well-understood technologies (like ASIC hardware accelerators and algorithmic deep learning) to achieve some pretty awesome leaps forward, like Tensor cores and the DLSS that they enable.
 
I hope it's not just a more powerful Switch. Switch is a device that stores and run software, with joycons is a handheld, with the dock and a TV is a console. Switch 2 could be a stand alone VR device too if you buy the Nintendo VR headset and put the Switch in it.
There’s… no room for this. It would be Wii U all over again: a flop

The Wii to Wii U was such a bizarre direction to take the system, it was completely alien to how most people played the system.

Nintendo going from a portable system you can dock to a TV…to a headset would be literally throwing their whole business away and shooting themselves in the foot.

Not to mention there’s like no market big enough for this segment.

And in any case, the 3DS was still more DS. The game boy advance was still more game boy. There have been times where they’ve done pretty much what is most similar to predecessor that is stronger and with a “gimmick” attached to it and been successful enough on the market.

It’s more that a portable device is more limited than a home console in what they can do.
 
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Nintendo handheld + Pokemon = Gravy train

Nintendo isn't going to risk that formula on some insane gimmick like a forced vr console.
 
I think it will likely release close to where the Switch launched in 2017 (so April/May in the poll), but I still selected October/November because that's when I'd like it to release.

EDIT: Just noticed that last question in the OP. At this point, Metroid Prime 4 should be a launch title for the next system, along with perhaps another game like Mario Kart 9 or something.

Sidebar: After the success of the film, I would hope Nintendo is sitting on a Mario game for release later this year or something to help carry the Switch to the 15million projection.
 
yeah no chance switch 2 will be about VR, maybe an added option for specific games like AR, but not how all their games will be based on
 
Maybe an optional gimmick? kinda like the Gear VR: a device you put your undocked switch on as a headset while you use the joycons as controllers. It would be the natural evolution of the Labo VR, but more durable and with more game support.

Of course, the switch will have to have the hardware needed to support this, so unlike they have a 1080p screen with 90 Hz refresh rate I doubt this will be the case.
 
Cross-posting from the current MC thread:

新大阪駅すぐ!京都のゲーム会社の次世代家庭用ハード機開発業務
Right next to Shin-Osaka Station! Development of next-generation home hardware for a game company in Kyoto
Development of next-generation game consoles; hearing, explaining, and adjusting requirements from customers; creating detailed design documents and unit test specifications based on hearing content; design - implementation - test evaluation; creation, verification, and reporting of verification items; handling post-release defects (identifying causes, correcting, and re-releasing); other risk presentations and operations Improvement, various proposals, etc.

In principle: This is a long-term dispatch job, renewable for 3 months. Work 2 to 3 days a week, other days can be handled remotely. Security is important to us, so when you come to work, you will work in a dedicated security room in the client's Osaka office. When working from home, you will work on a dedicated PC loaned to you by the client.

You will be involved in the development and modification of next-generation hardware for a famous game company. Development is done in a dedicated security room.
 
Hmm, looking at the map on the Nintendo Sales page, I don't think this is their office in Osaka (it's not right next to Shin Osaka station).

Maybe it's for the PS5 Pro :p
 
Hmm, looking at the map on the Nintendo Sales page, I don't think this is their office in Osaka (it's not right next to Shin Osaka station).

Maybe it's for the PS5 Pro :p
Copying my comment from the MediaCreate thread:

"Went to check Famiboards and it says that in job listing there's this:
西中島南方駅から徒歩5分、新大阪駅から徒歩10分
(5 min. walk from Nishinakajima-Minamikata Station, 10 min. walk from Shin-Osaka Station)
Which leads to a company named eSOL Co.,Ltd that worked on the Switch Lite.

I guess Switch 2 is closer and closer (finally)."
 
Copying my comment from the MediaCreate thread:

"Went to check Famiboards and it says that in job listing there's this:

Which leads to a company named eSOL Co.,Ltd that worked on the Switch Lite.

I guess Switch 2 is closer and closer (finally)."

as in the other topic: Switch LiteOled first!
 
Thank you once again @brutaka3
Also cross-posting:

To add more, Kysen at Famiboards pointed out their exFAT filesystem was used by Nintendo for the Lite.
This company's exFAT file system "PrFILE 2 exFAT" was used for the Nintendo Switch Lite.
as in the other topic: Switch LiteOled first!
Well, the hiring ads specifically says next-generation hardware for a company based on Kyoto. And if it were a Lite OLED, we would have known through dataming as Nintendo has to do the preparations for it on the OS side.
 
Well, the hiring ads specifically says next-generation hardware for a company based on Kyoto. And if it were a Lite OLED, we would have known through dataming as Nintendo has to do the preparations for it on the OS side.
It even says "home hardware".
 
And another one. Cloud Engineer for Analytics position for a Tokyo based company working on next-generation hardware in the game industry. Seems like Nintendo Next Generation Hardware coming in the next 18 months(at max) is a lock.

Thanks once again to Kysen at Famiboards!

Agent Service Requesting Application
Contracted Development】Cloud Engineer for next generation game console [Average monthly overtime: 9.8 hours / Average years of service: 10.4 years] eSOL Inc.
Full-time employee
Listed company
Scheduled posting period:2023/4/17 (Mon) - 2023/7/16 (Sun)
Agent service to request application
View Concerned
Application Requirements
How to Apply
Recruitment Requirements
Job Description
Cloud Engineer for next generation game consoles.
This is an opportunity for an experienced Cloud Engineer to join a leading company in the gaming industry.
We are looking for an experienced Software Engineer to join our team in the development of software and systems for the cloud environment related to next generation gaming devices. The company is a global leader in the development of software and systems for the next generation of gaming devices.

■Details:
You will be responsible for developing systems that absorb game playing conditions from around the world, analyze big data, and propose services suitable for each user. We are developing algorithms to analyze large amounts of data efficiently and are making other advanced efforts.
<Currently, we are dealing with industries related to game devices.

The appeal of this position:
The position is attractive for the following reasons: ・Experience from the upstream, such as the formulation of software requirement specifications, will not only improve your individual skills, but also give you a deeper and broader understanding of the products and systems required by our clients.
We believe that we can make a broad contribution to society by linking products or systems together in the cloud.
It is challenging to be involved in system development related to next-generation game devices.
 
And another one. Cloud Engineer for Analytics position for a Tokyo based company working on next-generation hardware in the game industry. Seems like Nintendo Next Generation Hardware coming in the next 18 months(at max) is a lock.

Thanks once again to Kysen at Famiboards!

as I mentioned on famiboards, this reads more for data analytics than "cloud" as we are thinking of it
 
My 2 cents is they will have Hardware Direct in January or February dedicating to showing of improvements in top selling games that will get some fancy updates like FPS boost on new hardware and a new mode or tease for new thing that will be in a sequel. I feel that Jan is good since if they can wow the world they can make people in japan keep their new years money for its release and Captivate the full year with their console if it suffers no supply constraints it could beat a lot of records with Nintendo having to bolster the sales with good software to keep it up like Mario Kart new and Zelda DLC. June September feels like a we cant get supply at all in time to not make the transition awful so October-November feels like the second option in my opinion. Wonder what Titles they have for launch to cement it as a new console and if the will be Cross-gen or not.
 
My 2 cents is they will have Hardware Direct in January or February dedicating to showing of improvements in top selling games that will get some fancy updates like FPS boost on new hardware and a new mode or tease for new thing that will be in a sequel. I feel that Jan is good since if they can wow the world they can make people in japan keep their new years money for its release and Captivate the full year with their console if it suffers no supply constraints it could beat a lot of records with Nintendo having to bolster the sales with good software to keep it up like Mario Kart new and Zelda DLC. June September feels like a we cant get supply at all in time to not make the transition awful so October-November feels like the second option in my opinion. Wonder what Titles they have for launch to cement it as a new console and if the will be Cross-gen or not.
Why would you have a nearly year long campaign? That seems excessive in this day and age.


And, the new years buying coinciding with the new console reveal, the new console would have to be revealed in like the first few days of January for that to have them save money

That would be terrible right after Christmas shopping a few weeks back anyway.
 
Why would you have a nearly year long campaign? That seems excessive in this day and age.


And, the new years buying coinciding with the new console reveal, the new console would have to be revealed in like the first few days of January for that to have them save money

That would be terrible right after Christmas shopping a few weeks back anyway.
Sorry I guess I did not make myself clear by campaign I meant new software to attract people not like full blown year long advertisments and for the new year I would say a reveal on like 3rd or 4th for nintendo could happen if they want especially if it's pre-recorded direct. But we are free to disagree.
 
Maybe an optional gimmick? kinda like the Gear VR: a device you put your undocked switch on as a headset while you use the joycons as controllers. It would be the natural evolution of the Labo VR, but more durable and with more game support.

Of course, the switch will have to have the hardware needed to support this, so unlike they have a 1080p screen with 90 Hz refresh rate I doubt this will be the case.
I mean VR itself is a gimmick with a niche audience(compared to traditional gaming consoles). Also, I've yet to wear a pair of VR headsets that didn't make me uncomfortable after 30 minutes. The new Apple device is interesting but that price is a nonstarter.
 
Sorry I guess I did not make myself clear by campaign I meant new software to attract people not like full blown year long advertisments and for the new year I would say a reveal on like 3rd or 4th for nintendo could happen if they want especially if it's pre-recorded direct. But we are free to disagree.
That seems like a risky thing to do…. Just two weeks after they open presents something is announced that basically confirmed their purchase is obsolete? Idk…
 
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