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Mobile (Gacha) Market Tracking

New HSR banner not doing very well at all. I wonder if ZZZ is eating up the attention/money, big drop from any post-2.0 banner.

It's doing very bad in the West/Korea, and didn't do great in JP or CN either.
Is it doing even worse than boothill's (2.2 second half)? That'd be surprising.

Anyway, the character is not story-relevant, nor is it really popular or meta-relevant outside of one of the game modes (which players don't really like pulling for), so it's not much of a surprise to see it doing poorly. Even with 2 banners, July should see a rather big drop for HSR, as I don't anticipate Yunli to do much either.
 
New HSR banner not doing very well at all. I wonder if ZZZ is eating up the attention/money, big drop from any post-2.0 banner.

It's doing very bad in the West/Korea, and didn't do great in JP or CN either.
In China, I believe this is ongoing. 1+1+1<1 is becoming a consensus. After ZZZ was released, I saw a lot of videos expressing disappointment with MHY. Even the most MHY friendly video creators are just debating how good this game will be in the future (everyone acknowledges the boredom of this game now). Many videos discuss how the world built by MHY with money lost its effectiveness after ZZZ (Before the public beta in China, the level of praise for ZZZ is no worse than before the release of 2077). On some account trading platforms in China, HSR and Genshin account crashes after the launch of ZZZ.

I think the cash flow of MHY games is flowing towards WW. WW's two new roles in 1.1 have replaced the previous positioning of Genshin Impact's famous female roles on our Internet. If this company can repeat their 1.1 work multiple times, I expect they will become the new Genshin.
 
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In China, I believe this is ongoing. 1+1+1<1 is becoming a consensus. After ZZZ was released, I saw a lot of videos expressing disappointment with MHY. Even the most MHY friendly video creators are just debating how good this game will be in the future (everyone acknowledges the boredom of this game now). Many videos discuss how the world built by MHY with money lost its effectiveness after ZZZ (Before the public beta in China, the level of praise for ZZZ is no worse than before the release of 2077). On some account trading platforms in China, HSR and Genshin account crashes after the launch of ZZZ.

I think the cash flow of MHY games is flowing towards WW. WW's two new roles in 1.1 have replaced the previous positioning of Genshin Impact's famous female roles on our Internet. If this company can repeat their 1.1 work multiple times, I expect they will become the new Genshin.
Considering I doubt WW will even make 10M in china through july with mobile revenue, this seems really delusional and out of touch.
 
Considering I doubt WW will even make 10M in china through july with mobile revenue, this seems really delusional and out of touch.
The game revenue in China is much higher than many people imagine, and current statistical agencies can only count our iOS revenue. That's just a very, very small part. Android is the mainstream in China.

WW's revenue in China is currently one level lower than Genshin's, but this is not a huge gap. So I said it needs to be repeated multiple times.
 
The game revenue in China is much higher than many people imagine, and current statistical agencies can only count our iOS revenue. That's just a very, very small part. Android is the mainstream in China.

WW's revenue in China is currently one level lower than Genshin's, but this is not a huge gap. So I said it needs to be repeated multiple times.
Is there any particular reason why Android revenue wouldn't reflect iOS revenue (relatively speaking)?
 
The game revenue in China is much higher than many people imagine, and current statistical agencies can only count our iOS revenue. That's just a very, very small part. Android is the mainstream in China.

WW's revenue in China is currently one level lower than Genshin's, but this is not a huge gap. So I said it needs to be repeated multiple times.
There is no reason to assume the market shares would be much different on android than what is indicated by IOS.

If you want to dispute it you are welcome to submit data that isn't just "trust me bro, I am chinese" though.
 
Is there any particular reason why Android revenue wouldn't reflect iOS revenue (relatively speaking)?
The revenue of Honor of Kings on Android is almost 5 times that of iOS, and you can check its data in the financial report. At the same time, the anime game is closer to 1. There are significant differences in different games. Generally speaking, we believe that iOS users are more inclined towards women and high paying groups.
 
There is no reason to assume the market shares would be much different on android than what is indicated by IOS.

If you want to dispute it you are welcome to submit data that isn't just "trust me bro, I am chinese" though.
I have already answered the difference in shares. My intention was not this, I just feel that the numbers you mentioned are relatively low compared to China.

For the special case of WW, we usually consider it more inclined towards PC rather than Android. The performance of WW and Genshin Impact is similar, and this data comes from the recent daily iOS bestseller rankings. Genshin is currently around 30, while WW is around 40. In fact, WW's recent performance has been unusually stable compared to before.
 
Is it doing even worse than boothill's (2.2 second half)? That'd be surprising.

Anyway, the character is not story-relevant, nor is it really popular or meta-relevant outside of one of the game modes (which players don't really like pulling for), so it's not much of a surprise to see it doing poorly. Even with 2 banners, July should see a rather big drop for HSR, as I don't anticipate Yunli to do much either.

This is worse than any recent banner so I would say yes. Firefly + ZZZ sucked up all the money perhaps.
 
I have already answered the difference in shares. My intention was not this, I just feel that the numbers you mentioned are relatively low compared to China.
That might be what you feel but it doesn't really change what the rankings are. Even on android it doesn't look impressive so I'm not sure why it would be any different.

For the special case of WW, we usually consider it more inclined towards PC rather than Android. The performance of WW and Genshin Impact is similar, and this data comes from the recent daily iOS bestseller rankings. Genshin is currently around 30, while WW is around 40. In fact, WW's recent performance has been unusually stable compared to before.
Even if we do account for it to be more PC skewing, which is possible, the gap would have to be astronomical to make up for mobile. I'm not sure what the point of comparing genshin and WW when they are low as well. Comparing performance when they actually release chars would make more sense.
 
This is worse than any recent banner so I would say yes. Firefly + ZZZ sucked up all the money perhaps.
There is also a game called 'Dust White Forbidden Zone' that has attracted many fans of MHY in the past. Many Genshin Impact forums are now occupied by fans of this game.

This game has a special genre that makes it completely PC oriented. Although the current performance of the game's revenue is not high enough, the actual revenue may only be one tenth of Genshin's. But in the current Chinese gaming forums and public opinion, its fan frenzy is invincible. Their fans will really take the initiative to attack any other anime game just like the war, especially MHY's games.
 
There is also a game called 'Dust White Forbidden Zone' that has attracted many fans of MHY in the past. Many Genshin Impact forums are now occupied by fans of this game.

This game has a special genre that makes it completely PC oriented. Although the current performance of the game's revenue is not high enough, the actual revenue may only be one tenth of Genshin's. But in the current Chinese gaming forums and public opinion, its fan frenzy is invincible. Their fans will really take the initiative to attack any other anime game just like the war, especially MHY's games.

My overview is all markets, so I don't think that's terribly relevant in US or EU or SK markets.
 
New HSR banner not doing very well at all. I wonder if ZZZ is eating up the attention/money, big drop from any post-2.0 banner.

It's doing very bad in the West/Korea, and didn't do great in JP or CN either.
Hm, is it the first case of mihoyo eating their own game? I feel like we had something similar in the beginning of Honkai launch.
 
What do you mean? By not bringing it to Gamescom?
It's mostly a joke, but yes.
This was last year.
9a77d83c3f940340fc2399f1df2a2416_5746529499732698573.jpg
 
https://www.4gamer.net/games/414/G041434/20240705001/
Q2 Japanese Rankings
This QuarterLast QuarterTitleDL ChangeRev Change
1​
1​
Monster Strike-28%-48%
2​
6​
Puzzle & Dragons-22%-11%
3​
12​
Legend of Mushroom-72%46%
4​
8​
Honkai: Star Rail-7%19%
5​
3​
Fate/Grand Order-27%-27%
6​
9​
Genshin Impact-28%-9%
7​
41​
Last War: Survival77%205%
8​
2​
Uma Musume Pretty Derby-27%-57%
9​
10​
eFootball 2024-28%-17%
10​
7​
Dragon Quest Walk36%-26%
11​
21​
Knives Out-13%13%
12​
17​
Goddess of Victory: NIKKE-27%-3%
13​
15​
Royal Match-45%-10%
14​
-Gakuen Idolmaster (May 16th~)--
15​
4​
Pro Baseball Spirits A-21%-55%
16​
23​
Ensemble Stars!! Music0%-3%
17​
18​
Project Sekai-20%-25%
18​
27​
Whiteout Survival-11%14%
19​
22​
Jujutsu Kaisen Phantom Parade-48%-16%
20​
20​
Puzzle & Survival19%-21%
21​
11​
Pokémon GO-3%-50%
22​
13​
Blue Archive-45%-45%
23​
16​
LINE: Disney Tsum Tsum-43%-42%
24​
14​
ONE PIECE Bounty Rush-36%-48%
25​
25​
Monster Hunter Now-21%-16%
June Sensor Tower Japanese rankings
This MonthLast MonthTitle
16Puzzle & Dragons
21Monster Strike
37Gakuen Idolmaster
49Uma Musume: Pretty Derby
55Last War: Survival
62Honkai: Star Rail
713Genshin Impact
84Fate/Grand Order
96Legend of Mushroom
1011eFootball
1116Pro Baseball Spirits A
1225Jujutsu Kaisen: Phantom Parade
1310Dragon Quest Walk
1412Knives Out
1514Royal Match
1647Wuthering Waves
1726Whiteout Survival
1827Pokémon GO
1928Monster Hunter Now
208Goddess of Victory: NIKKE
 
https://www.4gamer.net/games/414/G041434/20240705001/
Q2 Japanese Rankings
This QuarterLast QuarterTitleDL ChangeRev Change
1​
1​
Monster Strike-28%-48%
2​
6​
Puzzle & Dragons-22%-11%
3​
12​
Legend of Mushroom-72%46%
4​
8​
Honkai: Star Rail-7%19%
5​
3​
Fate/Grand Order-27%-27%
6​
9​
Genshin Impact-28%-9%
7​
41​
Last War: Survival77%205%
8​
2​
Uma Musume Pretty Derby-27%-57%
9​
10​
eFootball 2024-28%-17%
10​
7​
Dragon Quest Walk36%-26%
11​
21​
Knives Out-13%13%
12​
17​
Goddess of Victory: NIKKE-27%-3%
13​
15​
Royal Match-45%-10%
14​
-Gakuen Idolmaster (May 16th~)--
15​
4​
Pro Baseball Spirits A-21%-55%
16​
23​
Ensemble Stars!! Music0%-3%
17​
18​
Project Sekai-20%-25%
18​
27​
Whiteout Survival-11%14%
19​
22​
Jujutsu Kaisen Phantom Parade-48%-16%
20​
20​
Puzzle & Survival19%-21%
21​
11​
Pokémon GO-3%-50%
22​
13​
Blue Archive-45%-45%
23​
16​
LINE: Disney Tsum Tsum-43%-42%
24​
14​
ONE PIECE Bounty Rush-36%-48%
25​
25​
Monster Hunter Now-21%-16%
June Sensor Tower Japanese rankings
This MonthLast MonthTitle
16Puzzle & Dragons
21Monster Strike
37Gakuen Idolmaster
49Uma Musume: Pretty Derby
55Last War: Survival
62Honkai: Star Rail
713Genshin Impact
84Fate/Grand Order
96Legend of Mushroom
1011eFootball
1116Pro Baseball Spirits A
1225Jujutsu Kaisen: Phantom Parade
1310Dragon Quest Walk
1412Knives Out
1514Royal Match
1647Wuthering Waves
1726Whiteout Survival
1827Pokémon GO
1928Monster Hunter Now
208Goddess of Victory: NIKKE

Why is the fake-ad game Last War so high in Japan all of a sudden?
 
Why is the fake-ad game Last War so high in Japan all of a sudden?
It started in April which about 2 months after it happened in the US. I'm not exactly sure on why as the explanation in the 4gamer article is about a month late (TV ad campaign with Japanese comedians in early May) but, I assume it's probably similar to what with Whiteout Survival where the web ad campaign grabbed enough people. It's just that it worked better for Last War than Whiteout in Japan (whereas in the US, they are neck-and-neck)
 
It started in April which about 2 months after it happened in the US. I'm not exactly sure on why as the explanation in the 4gamer article is about a month late (TV ad campaign with Japanese comedians in early May) but, I assume it's probably similar to what with Whiteout Survival where the web ad campaign grabbed enough people. It's just that it worked better for Last War than Whiteout in Japan (whereas in the US, they are neck-and-neck)

Is it advertised differently in Japan from the fake US ads and stuff they run? Maybe that's what makes it standout better vs how all of the fake games are kinda similarly performing in the US.
 
Dust White Forbidden Zone and HSR have consistently maintained a close ranking on the best-selling iOS game charts in China. There are many factors that prevent direct comparison between these two, such as the duration of the event, the importance of the event itself, overseas and the degree of compatibility between PC and Mobile (in previous official reports, DWFZ mentioned that iOS accounts for 10%).

At this moment, DWFZ's popularity on the Chinese Reddit ranks first in the entire board. DWFZ is just a tiny studio production, but it has been reborn in just a few months, defeating games made by large capital companies.
 
Very white. I also can't tell what culture this is even supposed to represent, feels like they just hodgepodged a bunch of colonized nations and made them white.
I wonder how bad do they forecast the decrease in revenue if they made the skin appropriate for the setting?

As Nikke,Blue Archive and FGO has no issue making dark skinned chars

Hopefully Wuthering Waves won't follow Mihoyo
 
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I wonder how bad do they forecast the decrease in revenue if they made the skin appropriate for the setting?

As Nikke and FGO has no issue making dark skinned chars
They both do but, it's not like Nikke is building their scenario about cavorting around an African/Meso American locale. Nikke has maybe 6 dark-skinned characters with nearly everyone else being pasty white. FGO has the problem of making a third of their dark-skinned characters actually MENA figures so, there's like only one servant in the game actually from African. Similar for the indigenous people of the Americas. The 7th lostbelt is supposed to a Mesoamerican style civilization and while there are several characters that at least seem dark-skinned, the summonable servants are all white (except the one who is an alter of an existing servant). Another third of the dark-skinned characters are the alters or evil characters. Though I will commend FGO on their Indian cast as ignoring the pseudo servants, they tend to use the range of pigments for their characters. A lot of that is from the artist pako who tends to draw darker characters.
 


Need For Speed Mobile launched in China. I'm guessing EA plans for a global release since they and the NFS account is acknowledging it, unlike the past ones
 
Chinese players strongly oppose dark skinned characters unless they are very sexy. This trend is constantly strengthening. WW will not be an exception.
 
They both do but, it's not like Nikke is building their scenario about cavorting around an African/Meso American locale. Nikke has maybe 6 dark-skinned characters with nearly everyone else being pasty white. FGO has the problem of making a third of their dark-skinned characters actually MENA figures so, there's like only one servant in the game actually from African. Similar for the indigenous people of the Americas. The 7th lostbelt is supposed to a Mesoamerican style civilization and while there are several characters that at least seem dark-skinned, the summonable servants are all white (except the one who is an alter of an existing servant). Another third of the dark-skinned characters are the alters or evil characters. Though I will commend FGO on their Indian cast as ignoring the pseudo servants, they tend to use the range of pigments for their characters. A lot of that is from the artist pako who tends to draw darker characters.
well its actually better that nikke still makes it even not having a scenario/reason to make some sadly its <10 but better than nothing Enikk is the most prominent one in the main story

there’s around 5 african based servant in the lore but only two in game both Sheba and Andromeda are african base but the point is they still do it

7th lostbelt only introduced 4 new humanoid chars 1 alter since alot are dinosaurs/reptilian ones , Kukulkan and Nitrocris Alter were the banners. 1 Light Skinned, 1 Dark Skinned

Mihoyo has Zero dark skinned character leading the banner
 
Who are the darker skinned characters in Nikke?
I'm looking through the list on Nikke.gg and I only see 1 character, that is exactly "Hoyo dark" (a light tan).
And ya, Fate does have more dark skinned characters, but it also has literal blackface.
 
Very white. I also can't tell what culture this is even supposed to represent, feels like they just hodgepodged a bunch of colonized nations and made them white.
Latin america (mostly Aztec), Africa and Australia/New Zealand afaik
Who are the darker skinned characters in Nikke?
I'm looking through the list on Nikke.gg and I only see 1 character, that is exactly "Hoyo dark" (a light tan).
And ya, Fate does have more dark skinned characters, but it also has literal blackface.
Naga, Noir, Volume, Aria and Enikk are the darkest
Noise and Bay are light-dark (or maybe tanned in the case of Bay) so closer to Genshin
 
Naga, Noir, Volume, Aria and Enikk are the darkest
Noise and Bay are light-dark (or maybe tanned in the case of Bay) so closer to Genshin
With the exception of Aria (who I missed) and Enikk (who isn't playable, thus not relevant, Hoyo has tons of darker skinned NPCs), ya, it basically is just "Hoyo dark".
 
Who are the darker skinned characters in Nikke?
I'm looking through the list on Nikke.gg and I only see 1 character, that is exactly "Hoyo dark" (a light tan).
And ya, Fate does have more dark skinned characters, but it also has literal blackface.
Uh, did I miss something? What's the blackface in FGO?
 
They radically lightened the skin color for the NA release, but I’m assuming Emiya Alter would be the one. The fact he’s called Detroit Emiya officially is rough.
First time I heard about that and, yeah, after a bit of digging up, the original chara designer was... not smart about it, to say the least.

FGO has the problem of making a third of their dark-skinned characters actually MENA figures so, there's like only one servant in the game actually from African. Similar for the indigenous people of the Americas. The 7th lostbelt is supposed to a Mesoamerican style civilization and while there are several characters that at least seem dark-skinned, the summonable servants are all white (except the one who is an alter of an existing servant). Another third of the dark-skinned characters are the alters or evil characters. Though I will commend FGO on their Indian cast as ignoring the pseudo servants, they tend to use the range of pigments for their characters. A lot of that is from the artist pako who tends to draw darker characters.
In fairness, it's worth pointing out some Alters end up being whiter. Artoria is the perfect example, since she's the face of the franchise and her lighter-skinned Alter is noticeably less of a nice person.

In general, I'd have thought people would be satisfied with FGO on this topic since the devs have run a wide gamut of skin tones since early in the game's life (Darius is pretty much as dark-skinned as can be).
 
Chinese players strongly oppose dark skinned characters unless they are very sexy. This trend is constantly strengthening. WW will not be an exception.
Arent all these gacha units supposed to be attractive ? Seems like weird argument, its not like they are gonna make money on bad looking characters to begin with.

At the same time if they cant appreciate variety, screw them, they dont deserve darker skin Kings and Queens.
 
First time I heard about that and, yeah, after a bit of digging up, the original chara designer was... not smart about it, to say the least.


In fairness, it's worth pointing out some Alters end up being whiter. Artoria is the perfect example, since she's the face of the franchise and her lighter-skinned Alter is noticeably less of a nice person.

In general, I'd have thought people would be satisfied with FGO on this topic since the devs have run a wide gamut of skin tones since early in the game's life (Darius is pretty much as dark-skinned as can be).
Darius is almost as problematic as Emiya Alter. The pitch-black skin and being a mindless monstrous brute is not a good look. Darius was also a Persian king, meaning he should only a little dark, akin to Arash's skin tone.
In comparison to other Japanese media, FGO is not that bad, but it isn't really meeting the standards for a global property. Which is a problem when they take from so many global cultures (hence why Genshin Impact is so bad). The big stumbling points are all the summonable Latin American servants are all white people that represent Aztec/Mayan gods and all of Africa is represented by residents of the Nile plus Queen of Sheba so no representation of West, Central or South Africa along with poor representation of nonancient North Africans.
 
Arent all these gacha units supposed to be attractive ? Seems like weird argument, its not like they are gonna make money on bad looking characters to begin with.

At the same time if they cant appreciate variety, screw them, they dont deserve darker skin Kings and Queens.
It depends on how to define attractive characters. For most Chinese players, Genshin Impact has not launched attractive characters in the last year. There may be 1 or 2, but most of them are boring. During that year, Genshin Impact lost a lot of users in China.
 
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It depends on how to define attractive characters. For most Chinese players, Genshin Impact has not launched attractive characters in the last year. There may be 1 or 2, but most of them are boring.
Fair point, i dont play Genshin and am more familiar with HSR where most characters are supposed to be good/cool looking from what ive witnessed.
 
Fair point, i dont play Genshin and am more familiar with HSR where most characters are supposed to be good/cool looking from what ive witnessed.
Being cool is not enough. The female characters in every anime game are very good looking. Generally speaking, an attractive character means a female character with a good appearance, no bad character design or plot, and no ambiguous relationships with male characters other than the protagonist.

Take several female characters recently launched by Genshin Impact as example.
One of the female characters has a serious problem with the character design (she chose to be a pet of an animal), and the modeling is also very unappealing. There is a problem with the dialogue of a young female character. Its upcoming female character has been criticized for appearing like a stern instructor, and some account trading platforms even reject accounts with this character because it would lead to devaluation.
 
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Take several female characters recently launched by Genshin Impact as example.
One of the female characters has a serious problem with the character design (she chose to be a pet of an animal), and the modeling is also very unappealing. There is a problem with the dialogue of a young female character. Its upcoming female character has been criticized for appearing like a stern instructor, and some account trading platforms even reject accounts with this character because it would lead to devaluation.
Wow, that's a serious waifu business and drama there. I wonder if Hoyoverse will run out of archetype and characters eventually.
 
Wow, that's a serious waifu business and drama there. I wonder if Hoyoverse will run out of archetype and characters eventually.

They've long exhausted majority of the standard tropes, and many repeat. One of the big complaints levied against MHY nowadays is how many of their designs just blend together into an undefined soup.
 
Wow, that's a serious waifu business and drama there. I wonder if Hoyoverse will run out of archetype and characters eventually.
That's not a problem, the key is whether MHY has changed the idea of itself.
CN Players' complaints focus on too many male characters, too many ugly female characters, insufficient nudity of female characters, and official hints about intimate relationships between some female characters and male characters (which I think is the most important).
 
Also let's try to get back on topic, the deep dive into CN expectations/meta of selling to men is interesting but it will be obtuse to those outside of the community (as it is very hard to reference this stuff to more than hearsay). That said we do have obvious examples of it with Snowbreak's path from mediocrity to small success by going fully into pandering to the male gaze and selling the idea of marrying the units and such. We can discuss this in such context as it's backed by data!

The more clearcut issues MHY (and other companies) faces in representation and such, and possible impact on sales are still fine for now. Though try to keep it topical to sales.
 
DNFM has been ranked first on the Chinese iOS bestseller list for a month, and even Honor of Kings can only beat it for a few hours.

I am curious if this game is the highest grossing mobile game in the first month. The monthly revenue of Honor of Kings can be considered as $400 million (its annual revenue is usually considered as $7 billion, estimated based on Tencent's financial report). In news reports with low credibility, DNFM's first month revenue was $700 million.
 
DNFM has been ranked first on the Chinese iOS bestseller list for a month, and even Honor of Kings can only beat it for a few hours.

I am curious if this game is the highest grossing mobile game in the first month. The monthly revenue of Honor of Kings can be considered as $400 million (its annual revenue is usually considered as $7 billion, estimated based on Tencent's financial report). In news reports with low credibility, DNFM's first month revenue was $700 million.

Genshin had significant market gains in non-CN markets, and MonoGO also recently took the crown I believe. I am not sure if DFM will beat them.
 
That's not a problem, the key is whether MHY has changed the idea of itself.
CN Players' complaints focus on too many male characters, too many ugly female characters, insufficient nudity of female characters, and official hints about intimate relationships between some female characters and male characters (which I think is the most important).
Wasn't there leaks or rumors that Mihoyo has relations with a DEI group? I don't think it was Sweet Baby Inc but something like that. Not trying to divert the discussion to that topic, but I think it makes sense judging by how Mihoyo operates currently.

From a business perspective tho, DEI is associated with marketing in the West overtaking the industry. It's already relevant in most Western companies, and spreading quickly to the East. I would imagine Mihoyo is one of the many. Furthermore, due to the heavy restriction from the Chinese government towards video games and in general, Chinese gaming companies including Mihoyo have been looking at the overseas market more instead of the domestic. Mihoyo has the advantage and its the Chinese market. They know that they don't have to focus as much towards their homeland without competition from overseas. This might have resulted in Mihoyo to rely on DEI to adjust better towards the West, not knowing any better that it is potentially hurting them.
 
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