If all multiplatform means no Nintendo then it is.
Atlus output strategy | Discussion thread
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The only excuse for Atlus skipping Switch on their internal mainline games was bandwidth, and that went out the window when SMT V is coming out for everything.
P3R has 0 excuse not being on Switch to be fair. SH2 is just getting dropped from any future plans forever.
ItWasMeantToBe19
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It's like a billion times easier to upport something than downport something and uhh, it's an 18 month gap from the original release.
Persona 6 will definitely underperform imo and won't sell 5 million in 1 year like Sega's ambitious goals without Switch 2 so hopefully Sega is aware of that.
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As dumb as the whole thing sounds, it's honestly easier to believe this unless P3 Reload and Metaphor come to Switch 2 as late ports. Or SMT6 starts as a Switch exclusive. Because there's no other good reason, really.
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The new route is an 80 hours scenario that can be chosen from start. The meat of the development time was due to this.
I mean, people did say that Atlus wasn't supporting Switch because they couldn't support so many platforms. Once this excuse goes out of the window, people are legit miffed to realize that they really didn't planned on supporting the console at all. And to be frank, the Persona 3 Reload answer to why no Switch version already pointed in the same direction.
They have SEGA, nothing was stopping them from supporting multiple platforms including Switch. They just don't include it in titles that can run on it for nonsensical reasons. At least with Re:Fantazio there's no Xbox One version so saying hardware limitations has some actual support, but that'll still get debated.
There are worse excuses still going, like how demanding Atlus games are for Switch.
I accept that more than I accept people suggesting that ATLUS is actually supporting the system.
At least that isn't objectively disproven.
yea, that vita-HD looking Metaphor, SH2 which is surely pushing the XBO/PS4, and P3R and it's ray tracing are difficult to port
they just don't want them on switch, blud. ain't gotta come up with excuses for them
What's even odder that SMTV is Altus' best looking game this generation.
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More like the response to Atlus's output strategy (wink wink). SMTVV being multiplatform isn't a bad thing at all. The problem is that Atlus games skip Switch for their other "multiplatform" games which shows a clear double standard. So the whole "why are people so against others getting to play the game" is a misreading of the context. It's more "people are annoyed at the inconsistent platform choices of Atlus." All Atlus fans used to share this sentiment, but now that PS/PC/Xbox get all the Atlus games, Atlus fans on those platforms don't care anymore since it's only Nintendo platforms getting the short end of the stick. Sweeping the whole thing under the rug and then accusing Nintendo gamers of being against multiplatform games when they're the only ones that can't play most of the new Atlus games is extra ironic.
But I get it. Fans on those platforms only care about those platforms. From their perspective, any game is "all in on multiplatform" as long as it's on PS/PC/Xbox - Switch/Switch 2 be damned. It's just funny and sad when they go "Atlus is finally on all platforms and everyone can play their games now" when that definition of "everyone" is iffy at best, but you can't call it out on other places because you'll be dogpiled and labeled as a fanboy. Pretty sure at this point, you can only say this on InstallBase.
Yeah, is good that SMT V is now multiplatform, but is clear now that this "multiplatform strategy" doesn't really considers Nintendo, when the only new release from them was because of Nintendo's financial support. Meanwhile every other game just skips the platform without any actual reason for it. It's a shame, been really supporting Atlus for years on Nintendo platforms and this generation has been a disappointment on that side.
And I guess the joke is on me because I'm almost surely getting SMT V Vengeance on Switch...
And I guess the joke is on me because I'm almost surely getting SMT V Vengeance on Switch...
ItWasMeantToBe19
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Metaphor looks like shit, but it also runs like shit too, lol. All the footage shown so far is on the 12 TF Xbox Series X and the code is so bad that the Series X is struggling in footage.
Atlus' programmers are just bad.
The most baffling thing is Switch got P3 Portable, but not the remaster which looks worse than SMTV. Like, where's the logic?
The problem is people have been saying this for a solid 2 years now, purity testing or outright ignoring multiple Switch releases (Persona ports, P5T, EO Origins, Vanillaware stuff) all along the way. Really SMTVV is just more of the same from the regulars, hence the continuing crusade.
The bandwidth rationale never made sense (just as it didn't for Falcom), I've maintained the simple reality is just different teams and creatives are doing what they want. I don't disagree SH2, P3R and Metaphor all should've been on Switch day one (SH2 especially could've used it) but I disagree they aren't because Atlus as a whole has decided to sunset Switch and issued a company wide mandate from on high. Because frankly, they've been putting out too many Switch games for that to be true.
P3 Portable is a PSP game, and that's not the only inconsistent sequence of title releases. Xbox still doesn't have P5 Strikers despite having every other P5 game.
EDIT: Forgot the Dancing game, but that series is dead and abadoned too.
ATLUS published games (2022-2024):
Persona 4 Arena Ultimax (PS4/NSW/PC)
13 Sentinels: Aegis Rim (NSW)
Soul Hackers 2 (XBS/XBO/PS5/PS4/PC)
Persona 5 Royal (XBS/XBO/PS5/NSW/PC)
Persona 4 Golden (XBS/XBO/PS5/PS4/NSW)
Persona 3 Portable (XBS/XBO/PS5/PS4/NSW/PC)
Etrian Odyssey Origin Collection (NSW/PC)
Persona 5 Tactica (XBS/XBO/PS5/PS4/NSW/PC)
Persona 3 Reload (XBS/XBO/PS5/PS4/PC)
Unicorn Overlord (NSW/PS5/PS4)
Shin Megami Tensei V Vengeance (NSW/PS5/PS4/XBS/PC)
Metaphor Re Fantazio (XBS/PS5/PS4/PC)
There is a clear trend:
- New games (PlayStation/Xbox/PC)
- Old games, external studios, re-releases (PlayStation/Xbox/Switch/PC)
The only exception is EO but that's so niche it would have probably not been made at all on other platforms.
Persona 4 Arena Ultimax (PS4/NSW/PC)
13 Sentinels: Aegis Rim (NSW)
Soul Hackers 2 (XBS/XBO/PS5/PS4/PC)
Persona 5 Royal (XBS/XBO/PS5/NSW/PC)
Persona 4 Golden (XBS/XBO/PS5/PS4/NSW)
Persona 3 Portable (XBS/XBO/PS5/PS4/NSW/PC)
Etrian Odyssey Origin Collection (NSW/PC)
Persona 5 Tactica (XBS/XBO/PS5/PS4/NSW/PC)
Persona 3 Reload (XBS/XBO/PS5/PS4/PC)
Unicorn Overlord (NSW/PS5/PS4)
Shin Megami Tensei V Vengeance (NSW/PS5/PS4/XBS/PC)
Metaphor Re Fantazio (XBS/PS5/PS4/PC)
There is a clear trend:
- New games (PlayStation/Xbox/PC)
- Old games, external studios, re-releases (PlayStation/Xbox/Switch/PC)
The only exception is EO but that's so niche it would have probably not been made at all on other platforms.
I think EO6 or whatever that ends up being will be their last internal Switch 1 title and likely crossgen.
There's also room for more remasters (PS2 or 3DS Megaten/EO most likely) though those tend to be mainly or entirely farmed out with internal oversight.
Xbox very clearly only has the games Microsoft pays for
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For what's worth, you can still support the Switch SKU while sending Atlus a message in their surveys about how you're disappointed with the treament Switch has received from them so far
While true, let's be real: Sans for the Vanillaware stuff, most people don't care about the smaller and/or old stuff and see them more as a token support to the platform. They want to see the big titles also hitting the platform. The contrast of Atlus going from 3DS biggest supporter to "Too high-spec" to hit Switch is also jarring.
People will also remember that Atlus went from hell to heave to port and downgrade Catherine PS4 SKU to the PS Vita. Only for it to sell 10k copies. Yet such effort isn't spared towards the Nintendo console. So it's understandable that people are miffed and outright pissed.
P5T is an external game in the same way TOTK is an external game. P3R is a new game in the same way Mario vs Donkey Kong is a new game.
Team Maniax (Dept 1) was the only one all in on 3DS and to date all their HD games but one are on Switch, more than any other current console or PC. And that one game that wasn't cratered so hard it likely killed any future non-mainline Megatens from them.
P-Studio (Dept 2) is iffy on Switch but they were iffier on 3DS while being solid on Vita. Studio Zero (Dept 3) didn't even bother with 3DS but at least still did one crusty Catherine FB port on Switch. Metaphor and P3R skipping Switch isn't completely surprising when you look at the legacy of these devs, although it is a definite missed opportunity and dissapointing after they both showed some promise earlier. The only real jarring surprise was SH2 and I'd say Maniax probably learned a good lesson there.
I think that's fair, of course P3R should be on Switch for example, but it still comes down to divisions.
Team Maniax (Dept 1) was the only one all in on 3DS and to date all their HD games but one are on Switch, more than any other current console or PC. And that one game that wasn't cratered so hard it likely killed any future non-mainline Megatens from them.
P-Studio (Dept 2) is iffy on Switch but they were iffier on 3DS while being solid on Vita. Studio Zero (Dept 3) didn't even bother with 3DS but at least still did one crusty Catherine FB port on Switch. Metaphor and P3R skipping Switch isn't completely surprising when you look at the legacy of these devs, although it is a definite missed opportunity and dissapointing after they both showed some promise earlier. The only real jarring surprise was SH2 and I'd say Maniax probably learned a good lesson there.
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Pretty exciting to see SMTV end up everywhere. I never understood the tendency to dismiss ports as some kind of insult just because they happened more a year+ later, and only counting “new” games as something of consequence, so it’s pretty cool to see a port of SMTV.
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Where is my Etrian Odyssey VI, Devil Survivor 3, PQ3 with P1/P2 characters, and a new SMT spin-off on Switch? Oh wait, they spent the money on Soul Hackers 2...which isn't even on Switch!
Honestly, people would be fine if those titles are smaller budget titles. Not everything needs to be full 3D. Soul Hackers 2 is the very proof of that, a game where they sacrifice everything from the original to chase the PS/PC/Xbox audience that values graphical leaps and people didn't want it. It's fine to make a SMT game that looks and plays like a dungeon crawler that doesn't have big 3D levels. Their output wouldn't have suffered as much and the scope of their projects wouldn't have ballooned so quickly if they had realized that. The Switch audience would've accepted it. The problem is...Atlus really doesn't care what the Switch audience wants.
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This whole Atlus thing is still kinda baffling. And this is coming from someone who has a Switch and a PS5, so realistically I shouldn't have an issue.
IMO the crux of the issue is that Atlus has a sizable audience for games they've internally developed on Switch, the dominant platform in Japan and one of the highest selling platforms of all time, and yet they seem to actively be doing their best to ignore them entirely. Took Persona way too long to get Switch ports, yet unless Switch 2 somehow gets P3 Reload and Metaphor it seems to just be a one off thing. SMT's going multiplatform which is cool, but that might just open the door for SMT6 to jsut skip Nintendo platforms entirely. And with all due respect, nobody really cares about the other franchises. Maybe Etrian Odyssey but that franchise hasnt even seen a new game hit Switch after a bunch of 3DS support.
Thing is with Microsoft presumably paying for Atlus games now, it's far easier to imagine them going multiplatform the same way most big franchises do: all platforms bar Nintendo. I mean they all but said it with Soul Hackers 2. And people wont really complain about it like they used to because they have the games they care about on their platforms which is really what people care about at the end of the day. So what if SMT6 skips Switch, people will celebrate it finally getting free from Nintendo jail where it would've run at 15fps like SMTV did, and it runs better on Steam Deck anyways. It'll probably be the same with Switch 2, and Atlus is fine with that since Persona and SMT are more known worldwide now. But ultimately, how much money are they leaving on the table doing this?
Personally I'd like to be wrong. I'd like to have this thrown back at me, but I can't see it atm.
IMO the crux of the issue is that Atlus has a sizable audience for games they've internally developed on Switch, the dominant platform in Japan and one of the highest selling platforms of all time, and yet they seem to actively be doing their best to ignore them entirely. Took Persona way too long to get Switch ports, yet unless Switch 2 somehow gets P3 Reload and Metaphor it seems to just be a one off thing. SMT's going multiplatform which is cool, but that might just open the door for SMT6 to jsut skip Nintendo platforms entirely. And with all due respect, nobody really cares about the other franchises. Maybe Etrian Odyssey but that franchise hasnt even seen a new game hit Switch after a bunch of 3DS support.
Thing is with Microsoft presumably paying for Atlus games now, it's far easier to imagine them going multiplatform the same way most big franchises do: all platforms bar Nintendo. I mean they all but said it with Soul Hackers 2. And people wont really complain about it like they used to because they have the games they care about on their platforms which is really what people care about at the end of the day. So what if SMT6 skips Switch, people will celebrate it finally getting free from Nintendo jail where it would've run at 15fps like SMTV did, and it runs better on Steam Deck anyways. It'll probably be the same with Switch 2, and Atlus is fine with that since Persona and SMT are more known worldwide now. But ultimately, how much money are they leaving on the table doing this?
Personally I'd like to be wrong. I'd like to have this thrown back at me, but I can't see it atm.
How does going multiplat imply skipping a platform? They could've done that without going multi to begin with, Nintendo doesn't own SMT.
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This is Atlus idea of multiplatform though:
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Okay, my bad, I should've added quotes. The point I was trying to make there is that this is how people will react to SMT6 skipping switch because this is how people are reacting to SMTV Vengance going multiplatform. Like those are actual comments I've seen on r/Games, for example. (Though to be fair someone did try to argue the 15fps one.) I can link them if you want, not bullshitting.
No need, I believe you and expect the vast majority of people bitching about SMTV on reddit have never touched it, lol.
That said, hopefully Atlus fixed up performance for Vengeance.
So is this. Nothing stopping Atlus from just skipping Switch if they wanted to.
1. SMTVI wouldn't be going to Switch anyway, that game is years away.
2. SMTV's framerate does feel bad for some people, it's based on how sensitive people are to framedrops/frame-pacing.
3. The other complaints are either people console warring in 2024, which is already a joke, or just shitposters.
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But having P3 Reload and Methaphor releasing X months later, when facing significanlty lower porting/optimization issues seems like the smartest decision for a company that was never good at optimization. I genuinely take it for granted that P3 will be there at launch and Metaphor either at launch or shortly after.
P3 Reload is an UE4 game, we can't keep forgetting this. It's the same engine V is on and Switch is confirmed for 7 years to be compatible with, regardless of how the end product runs. And you can't say Atlus cares about optimization issues when the Switch trailer for Vengeance still shows slowdown, they will take the hit to frames without issue. The original game sold a million units, so the fans don't care that largely about it either.
That and hardcore gamers really needs to stop telling casuals what they shouldn't or should want. Over a million people bought SMTV despite its issues and it's the most successful SMT to date by a large margin. That should tell you that a good chuck of people don't care about frame-pacing or frame-rate. Heck, the horrible PC-ports that sold last year and Pokemon S/V setting the charts on fire should have told people how much the general audience give a flip about performance. I mean, the biggest game of this year right now is Palworld and is runs like crap.
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So what's everyone thoughts on Vengeance's sales potential? Will it sell way more (on "real platforms") than SMTV on Switch like the portbeggars and console warriors were saying (more than 1.1m)? Or will it end up being just all bark and no bite with Vengeance ending up near Nocturne HD's sales (around 600k WW or less)? Will the majority of Vengeance's sales still be on Nintendo despite all the hardcore gamers on the internet saying they'll get it for PS5/PC? How will it do in Japan?
ItWasMeantToBe19
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I mean, if the game's story is viewed as much much better than the original and it gets great reviews because of that, it could do pretty well, but that's very unclear.
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Well, ironically enough, SMTV Vengeance releases on the same day as Shadows of the Erdtree, so uh...
On the other hand, it'll be a new game for those who didn't buy it on Switch due to Atlus's release strategy (that's so outdated Game Freak abandoned it 5 years ago). But that's no different than Persona 5 Royal going multiplatform.
still think it'll be half of the original. maybe 750K at best
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It's releasing on the same day as the Elden Ring DLC.
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Really excited to see what the changes entail, though I'm not prepared for the next wave of console warring lmao: "PlayStation/Xbox/PC saved SMTV's story which was held back by the Switch hardware" - something that obviously makes no sense with Vengeance being on Switch as well, but I'm 100% betting some crazy dude on the internet will say this. But I would definitely love to see SMTV get more love because it deserves it.
Didn't know until now and wow. Did they seriously announce Elden Ring DLC on the same day as Vengeance with the same release date? That's an unfortunate coincidence for Atlus. Even if they're different genres, Elden Ring will still sweep the marketing headlines and is a major game for the PS/Xbox/PC audience.
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I think the overlap between people who are into notoriously challenging and dreary turn based jrpg and notoriously challenging and dreary action rpg are probably pretty significant but who knows, maybe it won't matter too much. I'm not really expecting much from this sales wise, sadly.
It has always been this lol.
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Even with being a brand new story and many reworks, Switch owners will most either skip or play on another platform. So the others consoles will need to significantly step up here. From what we saw, I assume Vengeance will do another 1+M. The fact it's releasing on the same day as Elden Ring DLC significantly impacts it.